I passed by the Seagate Center today and I saw the bus of tonight’s performer parked outside. Yes, Glen Beck was in town to do his Christmas show.
I wasn’t driving. I was a passenger. The driver had the radio tuned to WSPD. It has been about a year that I gave up listening to this station. Before I asked the driver to switch the station I was “treated” to a vitriolic diatribe by the afternoon host/program director whose name I don’t recall. .
The diatribe? In a couple of minutes the host managed to impugn the intelligence the people of the city of Toledo (he probably meant the majority of the voting public) using very colorful, unkind language. He also called us apathetic. He then went on to disparage all elected officials. It seems we are too dumb to elect anyone except worthless and dishonest people. He closed his pontification by saying that this is why Toledo is such a broken down city.
I won’t take the time here to defend Toledo. One way or the other most everyone has already made up his or her mind. What I will point out is, when summing up the negative aspects of Toledo, WSPD radio has been a major player.
For example, IMO: The station helped escalate the hysteria leading to the riots in the North End. The clash of egos masquerading as a violation of freedom of the press hurt the city. Broadcasting Gen Beck’s syndicated show has done irreparable harm to the country.
At the time I was listening to WSPD Glen Beck was devoting a major portion of airtime to instilling apocalyptic fear of Iran. At the same time I was researching and learning about how the “neocons” were planning and preparing to go to war with Iran. I believed then, and still do, that Mr. Beck was preparing his listeners to find it acceptable to take a preemptive strike against Iran.
When the program director came to Toledo I made an honest effort to understand his interpretation of libertarianism. I gave him a year. At best, his idea of how this country should function could be described as a Utopian concept. Utopias would work if people would actually use a higher level of thinking. In the year I listened to the afternoon host I heard nothing even remotely resembling higher-level thinking. The one bright spot is Maggie Thurber. I don’t always agree with her but she had a sharp mind. I find her challenging. As for what’s his name, we’d be better off if he left town.
It's all about ratings. Rant and rave and make noise to get better ratings.
http://toledoohioneighborhoodconcerns.com/blog
to reinforce the negativism that pervades Toledo, and they seem to be succeeding.
The station claims to be "fair and balanced", which is a joke. They spew negatives, with an occasional positive thrown in. Costructive criticizm should be welcome, but to be "fair and balanced", some solutions should be offered.
lew
First, LEW, the 'fair and balanced' catch phrase is the Fox News logo and applies only to the news, and then only to the Fox feed of national news. WSPD has never claimed to be 'fair and balanced" and has, in fact, clearly stated that the opinions of the hosts are just that - opinions. And the news department is completely separate from the talk show portion of the programming.
Chico - while I appreciate your compliment, I cannot agree that WSPD, as a whole or even in part, is bad for Toledo. You may not agree with the positions the talk show hosts take, but this area has an extreme need for people to speak out with opinions, commentary and facts about the challenges we, as a community, face. After years in politics, I've seen first-hand how events and actions are covered - usually with just a repeat of whatever was said without any questioning of the reason or logic behind the assumptions. And, that goes for the basic philosophies espoused by many of the elected officials in terms of what solutions are proposed for the myriad of problems. We've had the same philosophies in public leadership roles for decades and, despite all the claims, these philosophies have not resulted in a thriving area.
My husband continues to say that the area is like a drug addict which hasn't hit rock bottom to know it needs to change. I like his analogy - and I can't help but see perspectives such as those offered on WSPD as a type of 'intervention.'
Another point is to separate the 'presentation' from the opinion. People may disagree with how a point is made, but is the point, itself, incorrect? Being able to separate these two aspects is what will lead to greater discussions.
Why is it that WSPD even uses the Fox News feed of national news?
Is this the station manager's decision, Clear Channel directive, what?
... I don't know the exact ins and outs of the decision but all the Clear Channel stations I've listened to in other cities use the Fox News Feed. Perhaps it's a contractual thing that Clear Channel nationally has agreed to?
But, various radio stations use various feeds. WSPD used to have one of the major three (it was either ABC or CBS but I don't remember which one, though I'm sure it wasn't NBC) networks and now they have Fox. To be quite honest, I rarely pay attention to the national news feed because I get more of my national/international news from multiple sources, but primarily internet sites. I do listen quite attentively to WSPD's local news.
If I have a chance, I'll ask about this and see if I can get a definite answer for you., :)
Thanks.
I can't help but see perspectives such as those offered on WSPD as a type of 'intervention
Ive also heard it asked - 'If an insect control person points out termite infestation in your home, do you thank him for the info he pointed out that you were not aware of, or do you just call him negative?'
Some people don't understand news commentary, unless it is aligned with their view of the world.
One can love Toledo and Toledo's mayor and listen to WSPD.
Maggie...There is always a need for opinions, commentary and facts. Personally, I don't care for Brian Wilson's presentation. If I heard you utter his words I would say it's time to fot you for a straight jacket. I don't care for most of his opinions either but he is entitled to them. Some of us are luckier than others in that he has a bigger soap box than most. This wasn't my point.
My point is this, and only this: Brian Wilson and WSPD have contributed to the negativity here in Toledo. While most of us are used to media and advertizing trying to manipulate us (it's called marketing), it is my opinion that this station has cleverly, at times, manipulated their listeners in a way that has had a negative impact on the city.
For my tastes, Mr Wilson is neither intellectually stimulating nor inovative. As for you and your husband, I would ask: What comes after the intervention? It is time to move to the next step.
it is my opinion that this station has cleverly, at times, manipulated their listeners in a way that has had a negative impact on the city.
examples??
I gave three in my original post
Right on Chico. WSPD is bad for Toledo. They poison the public airwaves. Very similar to the way some companies dump poisons into public water, they poison the minds of their listeners. That's their intent, and it works. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people parrot their talking points. It's time to call their sponsors, and tell them what you think. Better yet, boycott their sponsors (lead a public campaign to do so). You can find their sponsors on their website. Here are a few:
David Fairclough Fine Jewelers (419-843-8887)
Hansons Windows Siding Roofing (419-482-8400)
Advanced Limo (419-447-5466)
Toledo Web Pros (866-526-4309)
Seagate Foundation Services (419-244-5325)
I was in charge a few years back of setting up some radio advertisment. I meet with their sales staff. Afterward, I felt compelled to listen to the station to see what they were about. Needless to say, they didn't get our business.
I find it interesting that you think listeners are parroting the WSPD talking points rather than WSPD reflecting the ideas of their listeners.
For the record - there are no talking points. While the three hosts have similar philosophical views, we don't get together to coordinate what we're going to say or what the 'position' will be. It may be hard to believe, but three people looking at an issue from their own perspectives can come to similar conclusions, lol.
I find it interesting that you think listeners are parroting the WSPD talking points rather than WSPD reflecting the ideas of their listeners
When people practically quote a hosts idea word for word it becomes pretty clear that the propaganda has sunk in. But you are correct about the "talking points" comment of mine. I should have said "point of view". Btw, are there demographics that exist for WSPD's listenership? The reason I ask, is that I wonder if WSPD truly does reflect the view of their listeners. Afterall, Toledo is mostly Democratic-leaning. Or is this just an assumption?
...it's not an assumption that Toledo is mostly democratic-leaning...but republicans have been known to get elected, so that means that even democrats cross party lines. :)
I don't know about the demographics for the listenership - not something I've gotten in to in my short time at the station.
Although, I will share with you a comment I got. A guy called and told me he really didn't care what I said, he just liked the sound of my voice. Well, he clarified that he did care, but what I was saying wasn't anywhere near as important to him as the way I sounded when I said it. Personally, I was just glad he was listening to me.
While I'm sure it's a big factor, it isn't always the point of view that people listen to.
Chris... I find it interesting that you feel free to name some of the WSPD sponsors, but fail to mention your own business in the paragraph that followed your list. Although you didn't decide to sponsor WSPD, why don't you go ahead and tell us the name of your business and its phone number? Why pass up on some free advertising? Don't you want your phone to ring, too?
I'll let you know if I need your business.
He also called us apathetic.
By looking at voter turn out for the last, say, 10 years. Is he right?
He then went on to disparage all elected officials. It seems we are too dumb to elect anyone except worthless and dishonest people. He closed his pontification by saying that this is why Toledo is such a broken down city
I see no error here either. Dont shoot the messenger.
You may want to add these clients to your list: TARTA, which you just voted a levy for, the Toledo Symphony one of Toledo's jewels, the Toledo Zoo another of our gems, numerous top name auto dealers, the University of Toledo both football and basketball etc. etc. Here's an easier solution. If you don't like what you hear listen to something else. This works for both radio and television stations. At this point WSPD is the third most listened to show in the morning for adults, number one of the AM stations so you may be in the minority in your opinions but don't let that stop you from furthering damaging the business outlook in Toledo by boycotting people who are successful. What an open minded concept.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Oh, I don't doubt WSPD's success. Either fascist propaganda sells, or there are only so many talk show stations in Toledo. It's either WSPD or WTOD. Some competition....bravo on beating them.
Fraud said: "If you don't like what you hear listen to something else."
Translation: "Continue to let Clear Channel poison the public airwaves. Don't rock the boat. Don't try in enact any change. Go to sleep."
That's funny, you've got 2 hosts from the same station---one says we need to advocate for change. The other says don't try to change anything if it hurts us. Very hypocritical.
Translation: "Continue to let Clear Channel poison the public airwaves. Don't rock the boat. Don't try in enact any change. Go to sleep."
why would you even say that when that's the way toledo has voted for decades??
Just exactly who, who wants to make some changes from the current 'all hail to the mighty democrat/union empire' mindset have you voted for lately???
You should know, Chico, that what's his name, Brian Wilson, is also the program director for WSPD. He gets to control the message of the station all day, every day. Just like his idol, Roger Ailes.
WSPD Negative for Toledo. First of all CHICO the mayor needs his azz wiped, but you better move Brian Schwartz out of the way.
Second, I am an avid listener of the station, all the personalities try to do is bring to light the corrupt city government, all the crap that goes on in this town with the good Ole' boy network that has been destroying this town for years. Have you been downtown lately? There are so many empty buildings, I wish I was a plywood salesman. What progress has this city made over last 30 years? We are taxed beyond belief, business leave at a record pace for Wood County. Our City Council and Mayor take away business from private enterprise. We continue to be the laughing stock of Ohio down in Columbus.
Have you ever listened to Maggie Thurbur, who knows the ins and outs of this political community? She openly invites County Commissioners to come on her show to refute any facts that are said on any WSPD program, and none of them respond. Why?
Even the Blade listens to every program and transcribes it. Then they report stories on things discussed on the station, pretending like they did not hear it there.
Boycott there sponsors, ohh that's real intelligent for the economy.
The people of this town never cease to amaze and disappoint me.
...what to say, what topic to discuss, or what the message was supposed to be.
I've not been asked to take or advocate a position I don't agree with, either.
Sorry, Craig, but your speculation isn't supported by the facts.
The fact that all of the weekday personalities, both local and national, share "similar philosophical views" is merely coincidental, then?
...the national talk show hosts - only the ones I know personally.
Brian doesn't tell me what to think or say or what topics to cover or what opinion I'm 'supposed' to have about any issue. Perhaps my philosophical perspective is part of what got me the job, rather than any speculation that Brian Wilson dictates specific positions???
Are you saying or implying, Craig, that I'm not being truthful in this statement?
No, I don't think you are lying about the fact that he does not give you specific marching orders. I'm just saying he doesn't have to dictate specific positions since he knows your philosophical perspective.
You are, by far, the classiest of the lot. I think your presence at the station lends WSPD a credibility they would not otherwise have. By now, any of the other personalities would have resorted to name-calling and insults and ending their rant with the usual "And I mean that with all due respect."
Thank you for the compliment. It's much appreciated.
I heard the Glenn Beck broadcast about his thoughts on Toledo. Some guy called into the show to protest - said Beck was horrible for saying bad things, etc. Quite honestly - I agreed with everything Beck said about Toledo. He hit all the nails on the head - truth may hurt, but I imagine any visitor to Toledo is coming to the same conclusions. Maybe Toledoans are too close, or too loyal to Toledo to see it's problems in full - I don't know, thinking out loud. Sometimes, new eyes can see the problems that are hitting us square in the face but we're so immune, we don't see it (used to it?). That is probably a huge leap. I think Toledoan's just don't want to hear the truth when it's bad, and would rather feel giddy over misbegotten awards. This third best city award is a joke, but lots of Toledoans are patting Toledo on the back, thinking we're better than we are.
To boycott advertisers on WSPD is absurd - most radio stations (I think) let it be known that the opinions voiced are not necessarily the opinons of the station - just like tv stations do. (If I am wrong, let me know.) Chico - your anger is misplaced, or maybe you only like to hear good news, and pretend the bad things don't exist. Beck was 100 percent accurate - and problems don't get fixed by pretending they don't exist. If you think visitors won't come to Toledo based upon comments Beck made on wspd, you need to open your eyes. They won't 'not come', anymore then they 'will come' based on that stupid 3rd best city award & having a poet laureate. Toledo has survived lots of jokes & publicity - from cheesy songs to Klinger's comments on MASH. It will survive this as well. How well Toledo does in the future, will depend on how much we work to change the very things that Beck pointed out. Toledoan's are apathetic? Hell yes, they are. (although, I think public apathy peaked for all of Ohio when they passed the smoking ban, and try to ban games of chance.) Toledo IS a joke right now - get used to it or work to change it. I can say the same for Oregon, Ohio as well - the crooked politicians there are just as bad. And yet, the masses keep on voting for the same inept people. One example that comes to mind is the last sheriff election - all unions always vote for the Democrat - even though, Telb is as crooked & inefficient as they come. Toledo lost out on having a highly ethical, extremely well trained man, who knew first hand the atrocities going on at the jail & nepotism. Instead, the masses voted Telb in again. I think he & Oregon's mayor have been in office forever (and her name is Marge, not Mary).
At least we have given something else for to WSPD to whine about.
"Those mouth breathing bloggers are so mean."
They should be able to milk this for a week or so. Too bad they refuse to give out this web site's name. Of course we actually have a discussion here, verses being fed a bunch of crap.
WSPD has repeatedly asked Carty to list the "half truths, untruths, and outright lies" that he said WSPD spread.
So Sensor you got bigger stones than Carty? Would you care to elaborate on the 'crap' that theyre feeding us?
What's being said that's untrue? Or is it just the people who are in front of the mike's OPINIONS that you disagree with, and the items they speak about are factual?
Everything that comes out of Fred's or Wilson's mouth is pretty much crap. Their entire formula is to read the Blade, find a story to fiend horror about and start to spin it with a wing nut slant. The most recent things to come to mind are "discussion" about a poet laureate or polar bears.
it's just what I said.
Find another channel and change your pampers.
Your two examples - Polar Bears and the Poet Laureate...
Both reported by the blade -
Both commented on In Swamp bubbles
Both commented on in Toledo Talk
Note - on Swampb and TT, you can expand both topics to Global warming and the time/money the local government is spending on creating an art community, and you can say that both topics have been discussed EXTENSIVELY - with plenty of opinions on both sides of the issues...
SO - I'd say it's fair to say, they are topics that lots of people feel strongly about - which makes them an intelligent choice for talk radio.
BUT - If Fred talks about it, it's bad for Toledo, just because he gives his opinion. (An opinion that about half of the posters of either topic happen to agree with)
Give Fred a break! He's not a democrat, he cant have multiple opinions on the same issue!!!
If he talks about it, it's pollution and people should contact their advertisers and tell them to pull their business?
What a fucking moronic idea. And you morons want to talk about lack of originality?? The idea to call the advertisers when you don't like what you hear isn't even original!! Welcome to the club started by frigging CARTY!!!
You're in just about equal company.
Remember when WSPD reported that Carty parked illegally in a center lane and chastised some forestry workers for taking their break? That story took all of fifteen minutes to debunk, which raises the question: Why didn't WSPD realize the story was imbellished?
---------
"When I say your dumb name, please stand up briefly, but then quickly drop to your knees and forsake all others before me." -Ignignokt
There's a city full of walls you can post complaints at
I should point out that on a number of occasions i have mentioned this blog and others by name on my show. i find it interesting that people want wspd to change it's ways but are content to allow the city they live in to continue to lose population, businesses, and tax income while doing nothing to stop it. i'd love to hear what chico's and other's "positive' ideas are for moving the city forward. other than boycotting viable businesses of course. i await the brilliance i'm sure will follow below. by the way you can always call and be on the air, i won't interrupt and you'll be able to dazzle toledo with your ideas and maybe change a few minds.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
I don't hear a lot of ideas from you Fred... You spend your time telling everyone how bad everyone's else's ideas are. You bitch about taxes in Toledo, but we pay considerable less the many of suburbs. You also give the suburbs a free pass when it comes to levies. You droned on and on and on and on and on about the COSI levy, but hardly me word about Springfield or Sylvania levies.
Why? Because Toledo = Bad and suburbs = Good. Another long list as to why WSPD is bad for Toledo.
I propose a WSPD drinking game.
Everything Fred or Wilson say the following you have to take a shot...
"Bike Path"
"Flowers"
"Mouth Breathers"
Anyone have any others?
If I was inclined I could probably think of a lot...
"logic-free zone"
"audio radiance"
"demolition derby"
"carl funkboner"
To name a few...
WSPD is not bad for Toledo, Brian Wilson is. This stuttering, stammering, patter-spewing "pantload" has wrecked the station. He came to the wasteland of Toledo from the "logic-free zone" of DC to educate us ignorant hicks about how things should be. Now most of the local programming is a repetitive bitch session. With Fred slavishly parroting his boss in the morning and Wilson graciously dispensing his wisdom himself in the afternoon, it's a tag team of tough-talking whiners who have the difficult task of finding fault with morons like Carty and Konop, and who get into slapfights with the almighty Blade.
And now Glenn Beck, the flaccid Rush wannabe is lauded for stating the obvious, that Toledo looks like a disaster. How perceptive of him. I'm sure he didn't speak to Wilson at all before he came in order to know just what to say when he did his show here.
WSPD has never claimed to be 'fair and balanced" and has, in fact, clearly stated that the opinions of the hosts are just that - opinions. And the news department is completely separate from the talk show portion of the programming.
The news and talk departments are separate alright- the heads of the departments are married to each other! Can't get much more seperate than that! Nepotism anyone?
Another point is to separate the 'presentation' from the opinion. People may disagree with how a point is made, but is the point, itself, incorrect? Being able to separate these two aspects is what will lead to greater discussions.
True, although it's hard to separate the two when you're talking about a pompous ass like Wilson. The fact that someone who can barely utter a coherent sentence makes his living talking on the radio amazes me. Only in America!
Toledo has plenty of problems, anyone can see that. The hard thing to do is step up and try to fix them. C'mon Fred and Brian, when are you going to announce your candidacies for office? We need you two geniuses in charge, not behind a microphone! Stop teasing us with what could be, and go for it!
i find it interesting that people want wspd to change it's ways but are content to allow the city they live in to continue to lose population, businesses, and tax income while doing nothing to stop it.
Nice try Fred.
My point proven. When given an opportunity to promote their own ideas on how to improve the city the three geniuses above come up empty. BRAVO gentlemen/women BRAVO. Maybe the next posting will have some ideas, let's all read together......
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Go ahead and kick off the discussion. What ideas have the crack minds at WSPD been advocating in the past year?
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"When I say your dumb name, please stand up briefly, but then quickly drop to your knees and forsake all others before me." -Ignignokt
There's a city full of walls you can post complaints at
Fred, I hope you're not trolling here for ideas while you're on company time. Your boss is the ultimate font of ideas after all. You guys have all the answers, now run for office so we can watch and marvel. I'll vote for you.
Here's the deal. You, your station manager and your station in general are the ones who are constantly, on a daily basis, telling your listeners whats wrong with the city, the mayor, the daily paper, the ignorant, moronic voters who keep voting for candidates and issues/levies you don't think should be voted for and/or passed.
The onus is on you, the ones complaining the loudest, to offer something fresh and invigorating, beyond the standard conservative/liberterian drumbeat of less taxes, more individual liberty, yada, yada, yada, coming straight from a station owned by Clear Channel, whose 'national news feed' is supplied by Fox News.
You seemed to have a strong opinion on why Toledo isn't the great transportation hub you think it should be, and in your smug, I-know-it-all and-you-don't assclown attitude, you tell us that you know, but you're going to leave it to us idiots to figure it all out for ourselves.
Terrific.
That comes across stunningly as the type of attitude you accuse the mayor and the owners of the daily paper of having...."we know it all, and you don't. Let us lead you by the nose."
Why don't you and your station manager exercise your 'personal liberty and freedom of choice' and just get the hell out of Dodge if you don't like it so much.
Oh, I know, you're trying to 'save' us from ourselves, LOL, right?
The intervention would have to be accepted before you can move on.
Since he's the "answer man"--how much impact do local politicians truly have on an economy? Or are Toledo's economic woes in line with most cities in Ohio (and Michigan for that matter), due to lagging manufacturing industries---brought about by short-sighted trade policies?
Btw, I find that Policy Matters Ohio has some excellent ideas.
You raise an interesting point. Perhaps we'd be better off doing a comparison between the Perrysburg-area and the Toledo-area in terms of the impact local politicians can have on a local economy. Both areas share in the general regional economy, but a comparison between these two adjacent areas would yeild a better answer to your question. imho.
I think general economic theory would be better than looking at a single example, imho
...in supposing that local elected officials have little impact on economics of an area, it's always better to take a more global view where the impact of such decisions are minimized.
However, if you really want a realistic examination of whether or not local decisions impact the economics of a city, the best comparison is to find multiple cities within a same region (where all cities/residents are experiencing the same global/state impacts) and then see if differing local policies or taxes, for example, result in different outcomes in terms of the success or failures of ventures/populations/growth/investment/ etc...
But, I'm not an economist, so that's just my two cents...
My point was to ask--what has a larger inpact on local economy? Is it mayors/city council/county commissioners, etc? Or is things that are more or less out of their control (gas prices, housing bubble, etc)? This area's economic woes have larger been attributed to the lost manufacturing jobs, due to NAFTA
There is so much more this area could be doing that they would not need to blame everything on NAFTA. All I hear is blame. Blame Columbus, blame China, blame NAFTA, but what I do not hear is anyone taking responsibility. We are tired of blame, we want action. Some people are not waiting and are leaving and it will continue until the blame game stops and we deal with the issues here.
You should read Toledo follow Jersey City thread:
http://swampbubbles.com/should_toledo_follow_jersey_city
The City turned around when there was new refreshing leadership. Schundler quit making excuses and took action. That is what we need.
I thought their job was to return a good investment for their stock holders...
Which they don't.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=CCU&t=5y&l=on&z=m&q=l&c=
WSPD is not bad for Toledo, Brian Wilson is.
Well Hell, let's take him out back and beat the shit out of him!
Take a chill pill, ape shape. Brian down in sunny FL got it right - it's a radio station. It provides background noise in exchange for advertising dollars. In the rare event that someone at the station says something intelligent or thought provoking on the air - like, just for instance, Toledo is populated by apathetic political retards who can't come out of their boredom induced torpor long enough to fill out a ballot - a few local SIGS and overly reactive individuals on a caffeine buzz can add to their respective dental bills, call the station and thus reassure The Man that, yes, the transmitter really is working and that a few locals are listening.
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
Chill pill? Ape shape? I wasn't aware that our new poet laureate was here. Or is that "small L libertarian" code speak?
When has something "intelligent or thought provoking" ever escaped Wilson's mouth?
Hey we have got some serious problems here in our educational system and our city. I think we all want people who are going to address the problems and not hide behind superficial items such as awards/signs, registries, or blame LCIC organization leadership when they don’t have that much power over economic development and ignore peer office holders who are dropping the ball and making the situation worse. I think WSPD wants our elected officials to act in the best interest of the citizens, not the interests that get them elected. We complain about not being able to attract business and what does the city do? Create more rules and regulations. I am complaining right now about this. What is wrong? That is the fact. I bet if the City were to be bold and say, why don’t we try to decrease regulations and taxes things, the results would be surprising. But that would never happen because of the inbred governmental thought we have here and the us vs. them attitude. TPS is still not streaming their meetings over the Internet because I was the one to propose it (us vs. them and inbred thinking). We cannot ignore problems and if you say there is a problem, there is nothing wrong with that. Wanting to give group hugs and say everything is OK, is not going change Toledo’s fortunes (unlike other Ohio cities which had employment gains Toledo's unemployment rate increased). Superficial things do not affect change; they only gloss over what the problems are. Until we hear some leaders willing to address the root problems of a lousy business environment here, things are not going to change.
Also, watch what is said, in China when I was there, on TV everything would be positive, because the government did not want people talking about problems that may make them look bad. Sounds familiar……
Chico, WSPD is hardly a local phenomenon. Talk radio across the country is extremely "conservative" nowadays. From Wiki:
"The repeal of the FCC "fairness doctrine" in 1987—which had required that stations provide free air time for responses to any controversial opinions that were broadcast—provided an opportunity for a kind of partisan programming that had not previously existed."
"Two corollary rules of the doctrine, i.e., the "personal attack" rule and the "political editorial" rule, remained in practice until 2000. The "personal attack" rule applied whenever a person (or small group) was subject to a personal attack during a broadcast. Stations had to notify such persons (or groups) within a week of the attack, send them transcripts of what was said and offer the opportunity to respond on-the-air. The "political editorial" rule applied when a station broadcast editorials endorsing or opposing candidates for public office, and stipulated that the unendorsed candidates be notified and allowed a reasonable opportunity to respond.
The U.S. Court of Appeals, District of Columbia Circuit, ordered the FCC to justify these corollary rules in light of the decision to repeal the Fairness Doctrine. The FCC did not provide prompt justification, and ultimately ordered their repeal in 2000."
Craig - if you can get any of these elected officials who've been criticized to come on air, that'd be great!!!
But I invited Ben Konop to come on air with me to talk about the LCIC. I asked specifically about coming on to talk about the search for a new executive director. He wouldn't even call to say 'no'.
Last week, I sent an email to him and then also called his assistant to request a public record. I asked if he could please provide the reference for some stats he quoted. Now - that's not controversial - it's just a reference. But I can't get a return email, phone call or anything.
So, I'd LOVE to have Ben come on the show - but he won't. If there's anything you could do so that WSPD listeners will have his side of the issue, I'd really appreciate that.
As to the Fairness Doctrine - yes, talk radio is primarily conservative. But most people who identify themselves from the middle to the right perceive print media and most major television news networks to be rather liberal in perspective. I've even heard some local people comment that talk radio is the 'balance' to the liberal viewpoints in the 'other' media.
It all depends upon your own personal perspective when it comes to impressions of 'fairness' or 'balance' in the media we utilize. That's why I'm glad I have the internet because I can get more perspectives than just what I can get from a limited local source.
I'd like to know more about his views on the LCIC as well, but I can understand why he would avoid WSPD. I hope you do get to square off with him on that issue. Maybe he would agree to discuss it in a less hostile environment?
As far as MSM being liberal, that is a myth that has never really been true and is less so now, more than ever. I, too, love the 'net!
Craig, they are making money off of it. If I remember Springer bombed in Cleveland, now Frantz is there. Air America bombed. If there was no market, they would not be doing it. They are not forcing it down our throat and besides what happened to freedom of speech? We also have freedom to listen. WSPD can say what ever they want.
Free markets don't translate well to terrestrial radio. When you hear people talk about the Fairness Doctrine, that's demand for non-conservative AM radio. There's demand, just no supply.
It was 5:21p when i first asked for positive 8:19p and i haven't seen one yet. I thought this blog would be full of them based on the tone of the people complaining. but instead more complaining and asking for my suggestions, even though they don't like what i say. very curious i'd say. as for trolling, i can do it whenever i want my boss isn't carty and won't stop me from gathering info from any number of sources.
since you couldn't come up with any positive suggestions for moving the city forward, try answering this one, it should keep you busy for awhile.
Since Toledo/ Lucas County have access to rail, air, port, I-75, and Ohio Turnpike why hasn't the city become the hub of transportation activity it has the potential to become? Discuss among yourselves, I already know the answer.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
To Fred, Brian and Maggie,
Just keep on keepin on,
All of you do an excellent job on keeping us informed, and giving us a different view of this area's politics.
Kudos to all of you, and I will keep patronizing your sponsors and be a loyal listener(and proud of it).
Same goes for Glenn Beck. Having him here the last two days and getting his perspective of this sh*# hole we live in was a real eye opener
"Poison the airwaves"? C'mon, Chris and Chico. You're at liberty to speak, even if it does seem like rightwing nuttery. Partisan media is as old as colonial America.
As for public property and licensing -- which is how we consider the electromagnetic spectrum -- the public interest is still served. If you want more leftwing or even centrist views, there are more than enough broadcast frequencies available. Buy a license, transmit and speak your piece.
Since leftwing or centrist views seem to have little broadcast market value, such an approach promises failure. I'm the type of man who calculates such odds, and they don't seem good to me. But that's not the fault of some rightwing neo-conspiracy or government decree. It's just the culture. I'm frustrated by it too, but as I strongly value liberty (even the liberty to be a raving, militant member of the "Turd Right") I demand that broadcasters be left the hell alone. They bought the license, and set up their transmitters. If they choose to play "Toledo Rose" with their time, that's literally only their business.
There are zero AM frequencies available. The FCC is not even taking applications for them. None left.
And WSPD paid NOTHING for the broadcast license. They get it FREE under the condition of committing to serve the public interest. They are defined by law as a public trust.
I didn't know all that. If those are true, then the terms of the licensing should occupy our interest. Of course, this is all going to have to go through the Republican-controlled FCC. I don't foresee success, much like you really can't control corporations by their charters either.
How far do you'd think you'd get if you used the WSPD license terms to wrangle a slot in their programming for a leftwing opinion group?
chico - I don't believe for a minute that Brian Wilson or WSPD is negative about Toledo. Wilson often talks about it's good points - and yes, sometimes the show dwells on the negatives, the problems & issues - but those are what needs fixing. He could prattle on all day about our great zoo, the parks, etc. - who'd listen beyond an hour at most? All Toledoans know it's good points. We also tend to know most or all of it's bad points - but we don't always agree on how to fix them, or what caused them. Wilson has done a great pubic service I think. He lets the public know what he thinks - but it's usually what most other people are thinking as well. I've heard very little that I disagree with from Wilson's discussions. I can't say the same about Beck, but that's the great thing about having a brain - I can syphon out what I think is crap myself. I honestly don't understand why you think wspd & Brian Wilson are dragging Toledo down. If anything, I think Wilson's show has been a great shot in the arm.
brianinflorida said "Encourage a purge with the present system and start over. I know there are MANY younger politicans chewing at the bit for their chance, so just look past the Blade's "weighty" endorsements and vote FOR the COMMUNITY, not the Lucas County Democrat Party."
Sure there are, but the problem is, Toledoans keep on voting the same names in, or the elections are won simply by party affliation. Great example - the last election for sheriff in Lucas County. Telb has been sheriff forever, people keep voting him in. One of the men who ran for sheriff against him, knew all the real dirt that is going on under Telb's watch - he knows & has worked with Telb. He has a perfect record & is the most honest, moral, ethical, informed, educated in his field man I know. He was able to prove that Telb never alloted money for training his men, & that there was a lot of nepotism going on. He could prove so many horrible things about Telb, and the disaster waiting to happen jail. (I'm sure maggie knows who I'm talking about). This guy is not a politician - but he wanted to clean up the sheriff's dept & jail. It was a very close race, especially since this guy didn't have the money Telb did (he hated asking for donations). This guy is well known & highly respected in his field - and well liked. But he didn't have a chance of winning, because the unions always back the Democrat, and Telb snagged the Democrat label. Elections in Toledo are bought & paid for - in some way. If the person running doesnt get the union endorsement, he's history. Politics in Oregon, Ohio are just as rotten. The mayor owns everybody under her - God forbid you don't bow down to her whims - your job is gone. This just happened & I'm not at liberty to discuss it right now - but that sheriff election opened my eyes to how dirty local politics are.
When has something "intelligent or thought provoking" ever escaped Wilson's mouth?
Ok, wait a minute...
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
You could always invest in a transmitter and start your own pirate radio station.
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
Around election day, I tried listening to WSPD when they had the levy reps on and didn't like what I heard; therefore, I haven't had it on since. I think the "Voting for Theft and Slavery" message was the clincher. I choose to avoid the channel.
I was wondering how many listeners WSPD has? I don't mean some scientific, formulaic ratings mumbo jumbo but actual individuals. How many people actually listen to this station?
Why does it matter how many listeners they have? Since when does the number of listeners determine the validity of their arguments. Sounds more like you have an issue with how the material was presented. Did you take the time to understand the basis behind the hype? Or did you turn it off because they said something you did not like?
BTW - I did not buy their message about "voting for theft and slavery". I evaluated my vote on levies on a broader list of criteria. I actually thought about calling in to discuss the issue as their message and explanation was rather simplistic and in a representative democracy, i.e., republic, we vote for people that vote for taxes. So every time you vote for an elected representative you are voting for people that vote on your taxes. And WSPD thinks it is best if you get off your duff and vote - or maybe they only want like minded people to vote - but you can't have it both ways.
There are many examples where the public good is enhanced by public projects - but there should be certain criteria applied in deciding what would be within the province of "government". It is a little more complicated than the message they wanted us to accept.
Let’s see – if you don’t have a solution, but point out a problem you are negative.
If everyone waited until they had a solution, how many problems would be identified. This is another tactic many use to “shut people up” and intimidate them to silence.
I believe that people should offer up suggestions when they have them. But I don’t believe it to be a prerequisite in order to air your concerns.
Problem identification is the first step in solving the problem.
Some will undoubtedly not like the problem being discussed because of who brought it up or how it was presented. Frankly that has nothing to do with the legitimacy of the concern being identified.
I always separate the issue from the person. My concern is continual improvement and you can’t do that if you don’t open your eyes and understand the problems and obstacles in your path.
I’ll continue to listen to all sides and all sources. I may not be able to stand the drivel for long, but at least I know what is being said and hopefully why it is of concern.
As to WSPD, I think in general they have helped to open our eyes and suggested causes for the problems. Do I always agree with how they go about discussing the issue?
What was it maumeemom didnt' like? The fact that I refused to roll over and play dead for the levy proponents? Or Brians contention that by imposing taxes on him for things he doesn't use is theft? I'd love to hear your defense of either of these questions.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
What I didn’t like about WSPD was the presentation. I thought the personalities practically yelled and felt that they bullied the people with whom they were speaking. I remember during one interview the guest was making a very sensible comment and was cut off because, IMO, it didn’t jive with the host’s views. I can’t remember who it was, the bus guy or the Librarian, but you took issue with the way they calculated their patrons. They basically counted transactions not individuals. You wanted the number of individuals? Well I have worked in a Library and know that what you were asking is impossible to quantify. That is why I asked about the number of individuals who listen to your station – there is no way that you could provide me with that number.
I felt that you twisted some of the levy reps remarks – which is what the media does - “spin” is not unheard of. I just choose not to fall for it.
The WSPD personalities also throw out “scary” terms in order to intimidate your listeners. I was offended by the “Slavery” comment and again, that is my opinion, but from talking to friends and family – I was not the only one.
I am a busy mom and have better things to do with my time than to listen to your station. I am intelligent enough to research issues and develop my own opinions, I don’t need someone else telling me how to think.
You have the right to your opinions and to use the radio as a vehicle to express said opinions – I am not taking that away from you. I have the right to my opinion and the right to use this public forum as my vehicle with which to express that opinion.
What I am doing is saying that your station does not fill a need for me and that I do not find it enjoyable; therefore, I choose to do something else with my time and will be avoiding WSPD.
I have answered your question yet you have not answered mine, Fred.
I asked how many INDIVIDUALS listen to your station. Please either provide a figure and site its source or admit that this is not quantifiable and you were asking for something from others that you yourself cannot provide.
Avoiding the question really harms your credibility.
Actually I think that you pursuing this hurts your credibility.
A radio station cannot actually count the number of listeners down to the single person, obviously because they cannot physically count them. On the other hand, a bus service (Tarta) or a Library could actually have a concrete way of doing this - because they customer is physically there using the service, and you can physically count them as they enter / exit........
Actually, people can access the Library via the net and you don't know how many individuals are sitting at the computer using that service. Therefore, you cannot get an accurate count of individuals.
How do you propose counting individuals on the bus? I really would like to know how this would be done in a timely and efficient manner. How would you count the individuals that utilize the library? It would be like asking Meijer’s to identify all the individuals who shop there – no one would ask them to do this.
There is no good way to do this and that is why they rely on numbers of transactions or numbers derived from scientific formulas which have been established by their industries. They get their numbers in much the same way that radio ratings are determined.
I asked my question again because Fred is good at chastising people for not answering him but has avoided answering my question.
Sorry, I wasn't really trying to get down to the fine details on this. My point was simply that you can actually construct a system to count something(albeit difficult to fashion) when it is present (except for your exceptions), as apposed to radio listeners whom you must estimate.
Over 12 hours now and not one positive suggestion from any of the people who complained that the station is negative. Where are all the great ideas to move the city forward? Or are you all satisfied with Toledo the way it is? It appears you are all guillty of what you accuse others of, all talk (negative about wspd) no real solutions. Too funny.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Where are all the great ideas to move the city forward?
Here is my 5 minute list....
WSPD can stop being so negative on Toledo.
Get Southwyck fixed up... The 43614 and 43615 area codes are some of the most affluent areas in Toledo; they must be maintained.
Get the MLK bridge fixed. Sue the company they has been fucking around with it for the last 10 years. They clearly don't know what they are doing.
Give a tax rebate for anyone who has lived in Toledo for more then X years. We could fill in the blanks with some number based on the budget.
Work with the rest of NW Ohio region to create synergies where they make since.
Now that the Democrats are back in charge of congress, have Marcy leverage her position and seniority to bring in more dollars for economic development.
WSPD can stop being so negative on Toledo.
(negative comment - when you couldnt come up with viable examples)
Get Southwyck fixed up... The 43614 and 43615 area codes are some of the most affluent areas in Toledo; they must be maintained.
(and you say the republicans pander to the rich???)
Get the MLK bridge fixed. Sue the company they has been fucking around with it for the last 10 years. They clearly don't know what they are doing.
(Gee - Fred says the same thing relatively regularly - are you being hateful or just pointing out a problem?)
Give a tax rebate for anyone who has lived in Toledo for more then X years. We could fill in the blanks with some number based on the budget.
(selective tax cuts? Who gets to make up the difference, the people we're asking to move BACK to Toledo? How about just cut EVERYONE's burden??
Work with the rest of NW Ohio region to create synergies where they make [sense].
(We cant - not with Carty's my way or the highway attitude)
Now that the Democrats are back in charge of congress, have Marcy leverage her position and seniority to bring in more dollars for economic development.
(Riiiiiiiiiight - dont anyone hold your breath. Anything from Comrade Kaptur comes with a string attatched - straight to the unions...)
Can I get you a napkin to wipe the Kool-Aid that is drooling off your chin?
You have no back up to your comments, and the examples you provided were either baseless, or in the case of the bridge, you actually SHARE the same opinion as fred, but if someone's not on your spoon fed list of approved people, it's all koolaid.
You're laughable.
I know you feel that you must defend your master, but all Fred did was ask:
Where are all the great ideas to move the city forward?
And I listed a few things off the top of my head that would move the city forward.I wasn't asked to "back up" by comments. I was asked for ideas.
When my toddler is done with his Sponge Bob reading comprehension workbook I'm sure he would lend it to you. We can erase the answers or not - if you need it to be easier...
Nah, you keep it Sensor - I'm sure that being 15 years old, and having an old man like you, your kid needs all the help he can get.
I knew that was a mistake mentioning your child in the first place in this 'debate.'
"Give a tax rebate for anyone who has lived in Toledo for more then
X years. We could fill in the blanks with some number based on the
budget.
(selective tax cuts? Who gets to make up the difference, the people
we're asking to move BACK to Toledo? How about just cut EVERYONE's
burden??"
That's actually an interesting idea. In the real world, retention bonuses are given to retain longterm customers. Instead of just giving rebates based on years, how about using a calculation that gives more weight to citizens who typically underutilize city services?
---------
"When I say your dumb name, please stand up briefly, but then quickly drop to your knees and forsake all others before me." -Ignignokt
There's a city full of walls you can post complaints at
The sad part is that very few would end up paying all the taxes because many young people want to move away from toledo (including myself). Doesn't really make sense to have this type of tax rebate when you can't get people to stay (because there are few good paying non-union jobs). Maybe they should consider this for businesses instead.........
"Now that the Democrats are back in charge of congress, have Marcy leverage her position and seniority to bring in more dollars for economic development."
Funniest comment yet! Because the Dem's have done SO MUCH in the two years off of their huge referendum. Let's view their progress.
1. Have they stopped the Iraq war?
2. Have they impeached Bush?
3. What significant legislation have they passed?
4. Did gas prices go down like they promised?
5. Where are their approval ratings today?
And finally you finish by suggesting more pork-barrel spending. Well I say go right ahead because it was that type of free spending that added to the Repub's defeat as anything else so spend away and try to hold on to power.
MikeyA
MikeyA
Actually they have accomplished quite a bit:
* The first minimum wage increase in a decade went into effect in July helping the lowest-paid workers. Republicans repeatedly blocked the pay hike when they controlled Congress.
* Republicans lost their majority in last November's elections largely because of the Iraq war, but also due to voter disgust with ethics violations that left some Republican lawmakers and aides in jail or under investigation. Democrats pushed through ethics and lobbying reforms that public advocacy groups applauded while also saying the provisions could have been stronger. Bush is expected to sign the bill into law.
* Congress passed, and Bush signed into law on Friday, a series of post-September 11 anti-terrorism steps that had been recommended by an independent commission in 2004. These include broader screening of cargo bound for the United States, allocating more federal grants to cities at high-risk of attack and improving emergency workers' communications systems so they can better coordinate during an attack or natural disaster.
* The House and Senate passed different versions of a bill to significantly expand child health insurance coverage for those in low-income families not poor enough to qualify for Medicaid. Bush has threatened to veto either version, but Democrats may be able to override him.
* The House and Senate passed bills to help students handle soaring college costs and crack down on misconduct in the student loan industry. They likely will send Bush a bill in September that goes directly to the stressed wallets of middle-class parents.
* A popular measure allowing broader stem cell research that supporters hope will help cure Parkinson's disease and other incurable illnesses was passed a second time and Bush vetoed it a second time.
* Appealing to growing consumer fears of global warming and U.S. reliance on foreign oil, the Senate passed a bill mandating that cars get 40 percent better fuel efficiency and encouraging a dramatic increase in ethanol as a fuel. Democrats hope to send Bush a bill after the August recess.
* A fiscal 2008 budget plan passed with new controls that attempt to impose fiscal responsibility after years of huge budget deficits. Under the plan, any new tax cuts or spending increases would have to be paid for. Republicans complain there is no guarantee Bush's tax cuts will be renewed after 2010.
* After six years of mostly getting a free pass from Republicans, the Bush administration is facing oversight by committees with probes ranging from the Justice Department's firing of federal prosecutors to the Pentagon's handling of the death in Afghanistan of ex-football player Pat Tillman.
--Also, pork barrel spending is way down from when the repubs were in charge. In fact, "Republican appropriators in the Senate have collected more money in earmarks than any other members of Congress" according to The Hill
They have accomplished quite a bit. Too bad none of it is what they were elected for. Hence their approval numbers being lower than the president.
MikeyA
MikeyA
I agree mostly with what you are saying (although the Repubs rating in Congress in lower than the Dems, thus bringing the overall rating down). On one hand, the Dems look like they are "trying" on the surface to end the war, by sending bills to Bush with withdrawal deadlines. But they could just stop funding it if they really wanted to. I think they idea is to not rock the boat too much, knowing that they have an edge in the Presidential race. A flawed strategy that reeks of politics. However other accomplishment are truly obstructed by either a lack of votes in the Senate, or a Presidential veto, or filibuster. They only have a 51-49 advantage, when 60 votes is needed to stop a filibuster or override a veto.
I've already offered up a very positive suggestion for Toledo. Get your sponsors to pull their money from the station, and force the "brains" at Clear Channel to listen to citizens who say the station (WSPD) is not living up to it's FCC requirements of serving the public interest.
Genius.
Can I get your resume, I would like to bankrupt my business and you are the right candidate for the job!!!
Do not elect Mayor Scout again.
Get rid of all the cronies on city council.
Stop having our city government steal private business and chase business away with stupid license fees and made up laws.
Build a downtown arena with in a reasonable budget with no tax dollars.
Blow up Southwyck mall and start all over again.... NOT with Larry Finkbeiner oops I mean Dillin.
The marina district...... umm not sure what to do with that, the progress is breath taking.
There is a few, I'll work on more... Oh yea get Maggie Thurbur back in politics. I will start the Maggie for Mayor capaign right now!!!!
Show me something tangible that Maggie has done that makes her that much more outstanding than any other politician in Toledo or Lucas County.
Toledo lacks private investment for a variety of reasons. Toledo's ills don't stop at Government Center. What causes a company to move to the suburbs? Its' not taxes or license fees, I will guarantee you costs are up for those that move to the burbs. I doubt they moved because the Mayor wants Scout in his office. Come on, think a little deeper.
...but no thanks. Been there, done that...really don't like politics...
Brian Wilson is often more abrasive than he needs to be and as a lifelong Toledoan, I don't enjoy listening to him call me an idiot for continuing to allow our elected officials to do what they do. Every radio I own has a tuner and an on/off switch and if I bothered to read the owners manual I might be able to figure out how to use them but the bottom line is I can't argue with much of what he says about the way things are done in Toledo. Before I bring David Fairclough into the mix, should I boycott you if I don't like what you say on this blog? The First Amendment is a beautiful thing even if it means we occasionally have to put up with Al Franken and Ed Emery.
"it is my opinion that this station has cleverly, at times, manipulated their listeners in a way that has had a negative impact on the city. "
That type of thinking, so prevalent in our elected officials, scares the hell out of me. When someone else starts controlling what I can listen to we really have a problem. Thank God for giving me a brain, and TPS, UT and my parents for teaching me how to use it so I can decide who should manipulate me. I'll respect your right to do the same.
As for the positive, Fred's policy of allowing candidates free air time if and only if they say the positive things they will accomplish if elected clearly falls in that category. It cracks me up to hear how many of them have such a hard time with it.
Who likes WSPD and who doesn't?
Geez! My seven speaker stereo in my TJ is set to WSPD. When I turn the key, I either hear Fred, Maggie, or Brian. Truthfully, I only hear Brian when I sneak into a friend's workspace who has an AM radio.
Maggie, you were really worked up last night! Sooo... is it 'Convenience stores' or 'Carry outs.'
Are people from Michigan Michiganders or Michiganians?
Are people from Toledo, Toledoians, Toledoans, ToledDOHans, or Toodeleedoos?
but yes, paulhem...pretty irate about this ridiculousness...
a trick I learned from my journalism training: when confronted with such questions as yours above - rewrite the sentence to avoid the issue. Sometimes, it works better anyway...
So, instead of trying to figure out what to call people from MEEchigan, just call them people from Michigan...or our neighbors to the north...or...you get the idea.
:)
Another course of action would be to file a formal petition with the FCC to deny WSPD's renewal application. According to the FCC website:
You can file a formal protest against a station by filing a formal petition to deny its renewal application, or by sending us an informal objection to the application. You must file a petition to deny the application by the end of the first day of the last full calendar month of the expiring license term. (For example, if the license expires on December 31, you have to file your petition by the end of the day on December 1). Before you file a petition to deny an application, you should check our rules and policies, to make sure that the petition complies with our procedural requirements. Before their licenses expire, stations have to broadcast announcements giving the date the license will expire, the date on which a renewal application must be filed, and the date by which formal petitions against it must be filed. You can file an informal objection at any point until we either grant or deny the application.
During the renewal process, the FCC first determines if the station has served the public interest. I suppose if enough people filed a petition stating otherwise, the FCC would have to listen. The bad news is that, as GZ has noted the FCC is made up of 5 commissioners who are appointed by the President. The good news is that by the time WSPD's current application is up for renewal, 2012, there will probably be a Democratic President who would appoint FCC commissioners that may be more in tune with radio stations needing to serve the public interest.
Just when i thought I could get you on the record!
;-)
Just kidding...
Bravo, Mr. McCaskey. Your post sums things up quite nicely, but I feel the need to add a little something.
When you listen to any talk radio program, any voice or team of voices on the radio, think about Howard Stern. This is what each and every one of these voices aspires to. People who hated Stern listened to him, ditto with people who loved the man and his show, and many listened just to see what he'd do next. The important thing is, people listened. The audience was huge. That's what Fred is trying to accomplish - love him, hate him or don't care about him, none of that matters so long as you listen to him. Fred doesn't care what he says, what cause he champions or opposes, or who he pleases or irritates. People are listening, and that's what is important to Fred. Even being fined or fired for some inflammatory comment could have an up side to it, depending on the circumstances and the size of the audience.
So, when Fred trolls around the Swamp getting things stirred up, he's only doing what he's mediocre at - getting people to listen.
Don't like Fred? Want to really, really piss Fred off? Stop listening. Want to piss Fred off even more? Call Fred's sponsors and tell them that Fred made offensive remarks about paraplegic bi-racial dwarves and bridge clearances, and until Fred apologizes fully and completely to your satisfaction, you and your special interest group of independently wealthy physically challenged members won't shop at their store. If David Fairclough got a few letters like that, he'd begin to have second thoughts about WSPD, Fred and David Fairclough's advertising budget.
And I'll tell another dirty little secret while I'm at it. The thing that keeps Fred awake at night, the little thought that makes Fred's heart burn worse, the nagging little feeling that makes Fred "too tired tonight" is that Fred's ratings may be falling a point or two. People may not care enough about Fred to listen, and that's bad. Bad for advertising dollars, bad for WSPD, and real, real bad for poor old Fred, who won't even have the dignity of being – ah, let go – because Fred was brash and stupid enough to have made inflammatory, insensitive statements about dwarves, wheel chairs and bridge clearances on the air, oh no, Fred will have been reassigned because not enough people listened to Fred.
Poor Fred.
Oh well.
I'll tell you what, Fred. I know what you could do to kick those ratings right through the ceiling, and in six weeks or less you'll be the envy of every talk show host in T-Town. Let's see if you can think of the answer, because I already know. Post it right here on the Swamp, and I'll tell you if you're right or not.
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
That was a great post Jack. If you had been that funny when you were in radio, you'd still be there. Couple quick points- never listened to Stern for any length of time, found him to be offensive and puerile. Only say things on air that I believe. You can call David Fairclough and tell him whatever you like, since he and his wife both listen he'll know you are lying. As far as ratings go I'm not too worried, the show has double digit shares of audience which is good for an AM with three huge FM stations as competition.
Now as to the positive suggestions made by Chris and Sensor. Chris made no positive suggestions for bettering the city, but I didn't really expect him to since he is what we call a "whiner" in the business. Sensor at least made a stab at it and mentioned two things I have talked about numerous times on the air. Southwyck, which i live near and would like to see Larry Dillon develop if the mayor would get out of the way, a tax cut for residents which i have called for the last two years the MLK bridge which again we have talked about since before I did mornings, and the synergy of the local communities. I have interviewed mayors from pburg, sylvania, maumee and council people from other communities in lucas county and not one of them has said "i'd really like to work with mayor finkbeiner" I wonder why that is. When i asked a former economic develpment head why he no longer worked for toledo he flat out said "because the mayor's crazy".
So sensor thanks for listening, it looks like we agree on many things, which either makes you a nitpicker or a whiner i'll let others decide. Chris you have a lot of anger you need to deal with and i don't think the blog is helping. Madjack, nice to see you again write when you get work.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
Nice reply Fred!!
I love all the people who want your sponsors to boycott you and Brian.
Do these idiots understand thats why they sponsor your show, or Brian's show or even Maggie.
This is exactly what is wrong with this town, people who think the right way to do things is take money out of everyone's pocket. That is economic development Toledo style. ALL THE UNION DEMOCRATS PLEASE STAND UP.
As for "mad Jack" go cry me a river, at least Fred has a job in radio still, talk about brazen. Go down and see your buddy scout, maybe he can find work for you.
I know .....you can be Brian S. spokesman.........
Wow, nothing screams "Hack" more than a 2-bit DJ in failed city arguing with local bloggers about his worthless career. You've been in radio 26 years (is this right?). You claim to try to open people's eyes to the evil of their local officials, yet in 26 years you say nothing has changed? What does that say about your attempts? You really need to try harder, or go back to school. In the long-run, Toledo will rebound---but not because of any of your efforts.
I think what it says Chris is that there are a lot of people like yourself who are too ignorant or lazy to move the city forward.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
LOL I laugh when I hear people question if we should ban WSPD because their facist. When in fact trying to limit voices in the media is a FACIST IDEAL.
WSPD offers a conflicting viewpoint to the blade and to most of what the local politicians say. This is a good thing. Especially when they don't take as many liberties with the truth as the blade does.
Chico, your examples are thus:
"Broadcasting Gen Beck’s syndicated show has done irreparable harm to the country." - You then go on to talk about his stance on Iran. Personally I think identifying potential enemies to the public is a good thing so we're not shocked if we're attacked on our own soil again. Besides if it were irreparable harm then that means someone is dead or injured due to his actions. Who did Beck kill?
Not that I am a Beck fan. In fact I think he's one of the worst guys on the radio. His thoughts aren't well thought out in my opinion. Do I think he's done harm? No.
Secondly you mention North Toledo. Actually I wrote a paper on gun control and used two examples of local gun control with two distinct outcomes. One was the N. Toledo riot the other was the Birthday in the park issue. My analysis of them shows that the reactions of Toledo's government did more to incite violence than any form of media. I can get you a copy if you like.
And finally you mention Mr. Wilson's thought of a libertarian utopia. Um... this isn't a clear example. Just because you don't feel his thoughts are profound doesn't mean they're bad. It's an opinion and just that. I think most of your thoughts are stupid and not very thought out as well but that doesn't mean you're not entitled to them nor are you not entitled to share them.
Please stop trying to be a neofacist and control what Toledoans should listen to, read, watch, etc.
MikeyA
MikeyA
At the risk of being labeled nay-sayer, whiner, and nitpicker I offer up this fact filled article from the Columbus Dispatch. http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2007/12/06/Toled...
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
in posting the article, but it was reasonably balanced, pointing out both the good and the bad going on in this town and the challenges the city faces.
In fact, if your station was as balanced, there probably would have never been a topic started on here titled 'WSPD radio is bad for Toledo."
by helpfully posting the Dispatch story, we can all read how every other major city in this state, with the exception of Columbus, has the same problems and challenges Toledo faces. Are there Carty clones in Cleveland, Akron, Dayton, Youngstown directly responsible for their cities' decline?
I'm sure you must be a huge fan of thriving -Columbus mayor Michael Coleman, Democrat, a Toledo native, who is a member of Mayors Against Illegal Guns Coalition. Perhaps you'd be happier if he stayed around to run this city. You and your station manager could have had loads of fun dealing with the antics of his wife.
"we can all read how every other major city in this state, with the exception of Columbus, has the same problems and challenges Toledo faces."
God I hate it when people use that defense!!
Cant we take the reins and the responsibility of our own town and stop looking at other cities? There are successful and growing cities out there as well.
size-wise similar to Toledo except Columbus?
The point-being, this is a regional issue, and the solutions aren't simply what Carty and our local politicians do or don't do.
and unbelievable potential. You cannot help but have hard feelings toward the voters when you see the lines of pure bullshit they've bought recently.
The 'new and improved' Carty? Mr. I won't run for the school board if I fill Deborah Barnetts' seat for the balance of 2007 Ford? Oh no - don't criticize the voters here. They're just SO obviously very well informed, savvy citizens.
Politicians are far, far FAR too comfortable with predicting the outcome garnered from blatantly lying to the voters. They buy it. Every time. That can't be denied.
We're hemorrhaging a fifth of the residents every 6 years. You can do your own math there.
Our school district is one step above failure resting in 'Academic Watch'. Not the worst of the worst, just one step above it. And the union there is so comfortable on that perch that they're laying the groundwork for the teachers to administer their own schools now. Talk about the hen in the chicken coup. And the voters will buy it. They always do.
We have one of the highest unemployment rates, and the highest tax rate. Period. Whether you're discussing your paycheck or putting up guests at a local hotel - we're it. You can't pay anymore for hotel taxes than here.
Unemployment - any of you whistler's in the dark care to hazard a guess where we are in terms of employment.
Maybe you don't care for the presentation - but until you can talk about facts - you haven't any right to discuss the messenger let alone criticize.
You're just blowing hot air without a clue where the city actually stands. Not in terms of crime, taxation, education or government.
Do some homework and come back to discuss, will ya? I think I hear your Mommy calling you anyhow.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
Here's an interesting article from an FCC member.
Some highlights--
America lets radio and TV broadcasters use public airwaves worth more than half a trillion dollars for free. In return, we require that broadcasters serve the public interest: devoting at least some airtime for worthy programs that inform voters, support local arts and culture and educate our children
Using the public airwaves is a privilege — a lucrative one — not a right, and I fear the F.C.C. has not done enough to stand up for the public interest. Our policies should reward broadcasters that honor their pledge to serve that interest and penalize those that don’t.
I'm glad you put this up here, because you help to prove a point. The bias that generally exists on the television and in print doesn't thrive on the radio. You see, shows like Fred's or Brian's and yes (most importantly) Glenn Beck's, Rush Limbaugh's, and Sean Hannity's shows are equal time to the American people. Equal time in balancing out the message (or lack thereof) that comes from the television and print media.......
Take for example Air-America. How well did they do? Oh yeah never made it. Out of business.
For my $0.02, you can have the tv news and the paper. I don't have enough time in my day to watch crap on tv or read a paper (that has commentary that is worth less than the paper it is printed on). I am too busy working so I can pay my taxes for 'services' that I never wanted anyway........
I don't think you're following along. This isn't about newspapers or Air America. There is obviously some discontent with WSPD. The FCC gave them a broadcast license (FREE) under the conditions that they "serve the public interest". The airwaves belong to the public, and we need to make sure they hold up their end of the bargain. It's perfectly reasonable to shine the light on them and ask the question, "are they serving the public interest?" How is this any different from WSPD putting our public officials under scrutiny (rightfully so)?
WSPD is definitely serving the public interest on those criteria. The programs generally focus on the news of the day (def. a public service) and with that, focus on what we can do to make the community better regarding those issues, even if it means to be "negative" about local officials.
...do you think that this discussion about the impact of WSPD is a result of their mission, as you state, to 'serve the public interest?'
It would seem that the fact this is even being discussed demonstrates that they are doing so???
Now, you may disagree with the opinions the hosts have, but there are others who agree...the question then becomes, as Brian Wilson likes to say: WHO gets to decide the definition? In this case of 'public interest.'
Yes I agree
My two cents to turn Toledo (and Ohio) around -
1. Get rid of stupid, ineffective laws - especially those that infringe on the rights of private (and/or) small business owners - re: the smoking ban.
2. Turn the steamplant or Erie St Market (or riverboat) into a casino.
3. Stop voting by party alone.
4. Stop voting the same people (or party) in.
5. Spend less time bickering over the small stuff (and most of it is small stuff), and spend more time trying to work together - end the cliques & silly timewasting, repetitive dialogues that have been going on forever. Example: I don't follow TPS meetings, etc. because my kids have been out of school for some time (and they went to Washington Local). But from what I've seen on these blogs, they TPS players have been ranting about the same things, same people, same gripes - for a hell of a long time.
6. Let the schools grow a backbone again. When I was in school, the worst sins were chewing gum & passing notes. I remember, 7th grade bending over the dean's desk to get 3 hard whacks with a big wooden paddle for passing notes in study hall. My parents reinforced punishments at home if I did something wrong - most parents did. Schools have no power anymore - the kids don't have consequences, respect for authority - they actually have been known to threaten that their parents will sue. I'm not advocating corporal punishment (or whacks) - bad idea. I just have to wonder why more kids than ever before in history have more problems than ever before in history. They are the most educated, have the most freedoms of any generation before them, the most advantages & conveniences, better sex ed, more availabilty of birth control - and yet, there are more kids than ever that are diagnosed with bi-polar, adhd, add, depression - who are in serious meds for those; a larger drop out rate than ever since the 30's (I think), they are still getting pregnant, addicted, drunk, committing violent crimes, suicides. Somehow, I think there's a connection.
Just my two cents.
Why is it everywhere I go there is always a radio station that is bad for the city. I have lived in Raleigh, NC and WPTF was bad for Raleigh. Have lived in Atlanta and WGST is bad for Atlanta, now living in Toledo for the last 5 years, WSPD has the honor of being bad for Toledo. It's either WSPD or sports in this town, unless you go to FM
Wow it seems to me that you may have a bit of bias here! All three of the stations you have listed have a conservative basis in their commentary!
Perhaps you see 'those people' as the cause of all your problems...... Did ya ever think that maybe they actually cared for the community (as many of us do) and wanted it to grow and prosper, instead of withering on the vine (as it seems toledo always is).
Please examine what the programs present objectively, and do not rely on your emotion and sensation of 'negativity' to sway your opinions.
Can you make real progress without critical analysis? Or do you just want to look at everything with those rose colored glasses?
That post was my failed attempt at humor. I was trying to say that every city has a "bad for the community" radio station due to conservative view points. When I lived in Raleigh in the 90's, former Toledo broadcaster Jerry Agar was the afternoon host and there was a similar hatred towards WPTF.
I find nothing wrong with these bad radio stations as it provides a secondary view point from the mainstream media who.
If WSPD is bad for Toledo because it has a certain view point, then the rest of the cities media is also bad for Toledo as they have a certain view point.
Scott
As someone who got ripped apart by Wilson at the end of the Recall campaign because I chose to do things my way and for some other reasons, all I have to say is if you don't wanna listen, turn it off!! No matter what, the station needs ratings. If the above opinions that WSPD is bad for Toledo are a majority here in Toledo and surrounding area, the ratings will drop and Andy Stewart and company will be making changes. It's called Austrian/Free Market economics.
...Not that I'm complaining about WSPD, I listen to Beck and Rush if I'm not in class. I work too late to get up to hear Fred and Brian is on when I'm at work...
If you don't like it, just turn it off.
I need the conservative talking heads to balance out my liberal teacher's incessant and annoying rants.
Oh please, tell me how the Austrians do things. Haha. Seriously, I don't buy the "just turn it off" argument. You might as well say, "If you don't like the Mayor, just ignore him".
...Chris - and you know it..
We don't have a choice of a different Toledo Mayor to 'listen' to...you have multiple other choices of radio stations you can tune in to... No one forces you to abide by the choice of other listeners to have your radio permanently at 1370 AM.
:)
You do have a choice of mayors. You could move. But instead of moving, many people would rather work at making things better by holding public officials accountable (again, rightfully so). I could say the same about those that use the public airwaves free of charge. We could move (as in change the channel), or we could try to make things better by holding them more accountable (by making sure they serve the public interest).
That's funny Chris. I asked two days ago for people on this blog to put up or shut up, and I haven't seen one constructive idea from you yet on how to improve the city. I can't believe you are so stupid that you don't see the difference between turning off a radio to avoid something you don't like and selling your house, buying another, packing up all your belongings and family, and moving to another city to avoid the mayor. You should be on the show Are You Smarter Than A 5th Grader, some kid could really use the money he's win off you.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
You know, you're not making a strong case of serving the public interest by insulting the local bloggers. I have offered a very positive suggestion for improving the city a couple of times. But you didn't like it, because it shined the light on YOU and your station.
Now, in keeping with the subject of this thread (is WSPD bad for Toledo?), I think it's reasonable to ask if WSPD is indeed serving the public interest----since, you know, THAT'S THE MAIN STIPULATION FOR YOUR BROADCAST LICENSE.
"America lets radio and TV broadcasters use public airwaves worth more than half a trillion dollars for free. In return, we require that broadcasters serve the public interest: devoting at least some airtime for worthy programs that inform voters, support local arts and culture and educate our children."
I've got so many problems with the above FCC quote but they aren't relevant to this conversation. Public interest is defined by whom? The FCC I assume. If a licensed got revoked, Clear Channel's stable of attorneys would be all over this, no doubt, and probably win. The attorneys are salivating for a case like this - this is partly why they have a job.
Now, a radio station has to devote "at least SOME airtime" for local stuff and children. On Saturday and Sundays, all this boring programming is on.
Public interest does not apply to the entire program schedule of WSPD. Otherwise we would have some First Amendment issues and there is no such thing as the Fairness Doctrine anymore.
-Tom M.
Who decides on public interest obligations---fair question. As you said, probably the FCC since they act of behalf of the citizens. I found an interesting FCC article about this. In some parts, television is mentioned. But since the article is about "broadcasters" in general, I wonder if the same principles would apply to radio? One part that stood out was this:
Diversity: Broadcasters' activities should reflect the diversity of their communities. This could include: assessing programming to determine whether it reflects the changing society of the 21st century and meets the needs of all communities
Does WSPD "reflect the diversity of their community"?
Let's not forget the First Amendment here.
The FCC can claim to be able to regulate and "own" the airwaves, but freedom of speech is still prevalent in this country - even for radio stations. As a matter of fact, the Framers added the amendment not to protect what's popular,but to protect the not-so-popular speech. WSPD is protected whether one agrees with them or not.
You do have a choice of mayors. You could move.
My three brothers and I have all relocated. None of us wanted to move, but we couldn't find a job in the Toledo area. What choice do we have?
I blame the Toledo government for the state of the city. Toledo is not a gravel pit due to a natural disaster. This condition occurred because of bad management, and here I include the vast majority of Mayors and city councilmen.
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2007/1...
We can all understand, if you follow the links to the other cities the Dispatch reported on, that Toledo's problems are not unique to Ohio, not unique to the Rust Belt region in general. It has challenges. It has to adapt to changes, particularly in the manufacturing sector. It has little or nothing to do with Carty, his dog, his bikepath, his temper, his parking issues.
WSPD needs Carty, secretly loves Carty, because they feed off each other, and Carty's shoot-himself-in-foot shenanigans conveniently serves as raw meat for the drive-time audience and any boost in ratings that may ensue.
I'm sure Maggie Thurber, a life-long Toledo resident, cares about this city. I'd think Fred what's-his-name, who I see from his bio has been here since 1980, cares about this city. Does anyone think for a second the WSPD station manager and his wife, carpet-baggers from the D.C. area, care about what happens here? Think Clear Channel, with it's all-conservative-all-the-time mantra, cares about this city and what happens to it? We're a dot on the political/ratings map.
If Toledo were say, Columbus, an Ohio city doing pretty darn well, with a Democratic mayor, where oh where would WSPD be? I'm sure focused on Frankie Coleman's (mayor's wife) personal troubles and escapades.
Anyone here who thinks this city is dying, or already dead and can't bounce back, is, in fact, free to move elsewhere, free to exercise their peronal liberty and freedom of choice, as I hear so often on a certain local radio station. Just as yes, thousands already have, just as thousands have long-since fled many other rust-belt cities and towns for the sunny southwest, California or Florida.
The station manager has been here more than 20 years, a carpet bagger? You may be thinking of Brian Wilson the program director, a common mistake for people who nothing about radio and how it works. Your childish attempt to minimize me by not mentioning my last name is amuses me but only shows again your ignorance of facts you want to appear knowlegeable about. It's not that people think the city is dying, it is, the numbers prove that. The cure is the most important thing now but moving out is not the answer, neither is boycotting viable businesses. What you missed in the Dispatch story is the simple fact that even when evidence points to the continuing loss of manufacturing jobs in this country our leaders insist on basing our local economy on just that. Look at the charts that accompany the story....population down, manufacturing down, poverty up, Yes I saw the optimistic comment about our "geographical advantages" and I wonder why we haven't taken advantage of them. When I moved here in 1980 I was told then that we were at the center of a transportation hub and within reach of millions of people, why haven't we taken advantage of that?
How long has the river been there,the lake, the airport, the turnpike, I-75, the rails? How long before we take advantage of them? Kill the messenger if you want to but it doesn't make the message go away.
Here's to the crazy ones, the rebels, the troublemakers, the ones who see things differently -- they're not fond of rules... You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them, but the only thing you can't do is ignore them.
You're correct, I should have mentioned your last name.
Now, you mentioned the transportation hub about two days ago on here and and told us how you knew what the problem was but were going to leave it to the rest of us to figure it out., 'converse among yourselves' is I believe how you put it.
Why not just enlighten us with your opinion on this instead of playing 20 questions?
Again, the onus is on you and the station you represent, the ones screaming the loudest
was that the two largest employers in 2006 were Promedica and Mercy Health Partners, where as in 1962 they were Jeep and Libbey-Owens-Ford.
Is this not a step in the direction you think Toledo should go?
Kill the messenger if you want to but it doesn't make the message go away.
The hell it doesn't. When you arrived here 20 years ago, you should have been tarred, feathered and ridden out of town on a rail. You're a muck raker, a yellow journalist. You aren't terribly bright or well educated, and your only talent is making noise.
I think Chris made an excellent point about WSPD's license and service to the public. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I tend to believe that single statement might be the best comment Chris has made this year.
I think it's past time that someone, or several someones took a hard look at WSPD and service to the public.
Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack
...if we could only get rid of the First Amendment, then we could really get WSPD, Rush Limbaugh and anyone else who disagrees with you. Darn Framers!!!!
and here's the good one Fred provided yestereday:
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2007/12/06/Toled...
The only problem I see is there is no balance on the airwaves to WSPD.
If another station picked up Air America then this would be a non-issue because if you don't like what you hear on WSPD you can always flip over and listen to an opposing viewpoint. However AA hasn't proven to be profitable on a large scale. I like listening to AA from the detroit station I pick up (I believe 1270 or 1290 I don't remember which) when Stephanie Miller is on. I feel it helps me to see what the other side is saying. (I also get it on my XM radio) However there is no station as such in Toledo.
But that being said for years the Blade pushed the local democratic party and was (and some say still is) unchecked for years. And print media isn't regulated by the FCC, it's self regulated. Thus the liberties with the truth I mentioned before. We could easily ask "Is the blade good for Toledo" and get an equally diverse opinion.
However, the FCC does regulate the tv stations as well. They do not ask the questions that WSPD asks nor do they ask hard questions opposing WSPD's view. I'd say if anyone is doing a disservice to Toledo it would be them. They have allowed Toledo to go unchecked as much as the blade and they're regulated.
So if anything there's enough to go around. In the end I think it all balances out regardless of your views or political stance.
MikeyA
MikeyA
The alternative would be a nationally syndicated show with no local information. Althought I don't always or often agree I'm glad there's a place for opinions regarding local issues on the airwaves. I think it's pathetic that local politicians are afraid to go on because they don't want to answer tough questions on real issues.
Their fear is only 1/3rd of what's really pathetic here. The other parts are:
2. They avoid such things since there are many embarrassing questions they'd have to answer in the first place. The problem is that there are many issues that exist which give rise to these questions.
3. Toledoans don't care that their pols avoid making such answers. Hence, the avoidance of such media accountability is profitable for the Toledo pol.
I am amazed at the response my post has generated. I feel like I opened Pandora's Box. There are obviously many opinions about WSPD and talk radio. Many are thought provoking. I would not be surprised if Mr. Wilson (Since I truly haven’t listened to the station in over a year, I actually didn’t remember his name.) is reveling in all the attention.
Since some of you have asked, particularly Fred, you should know that I have low vision and poor health. It has taken me hours to read all the comments and since I created this thread, I feel obligated to read all the comments. Also, at times, I have to drop out to tend to health concerns, I will, however, always eventually respond. Unfortunately, I can’t respond to everyone. I don’t have the energy, Please accept my apologies. Having said that, I don’t expect any sympathy. Let me have it with both barrels, if you wish, if you can.
First, generally speaking, it is my contention, which I can back up with a variety of sources, that the world is experiencing major shifts in the way we think. It is also my contention that mainstream media and politics are among our institutions of traditional thought that will be the last to "get it", the last to speak openly and honestly about this change. So listening to a radio personality criticize a politician or vice versa is not where I want to spend my time. This is why I choose not to listen to WSPD. It is not productive. (I should state here that I am assuming that the station has not changed its views drastically this year.)
So Fred, if I'm going to take the time to have a discussion with you it will have to be on what really matters and more than a simplistic game of upsmanship. I would first suggest that you read/reread my comments and don’t assume I am in alignment with the thoughts of anyone else that has criticized you or the station. I don’t share the animus many have displayed herein. Secondly, I am going to speak of concepts, some of which I can back up with science and others of which, science has not yet developed the tools to measure. However, I offer as credibility, the Intelligence communities of Russia (and the USSR) and the U.S. who have incorporated these concepts into their work.
As I said, we are experiencing major shifts in the way we think. For this to happen the old ways have to fall apart to make way for the new ways. So whether you are a so-called liberal or conservative, there is plenty to criticize. In your arena the discourse doesn’t change. The reason being is that the change that is required no one is willing to make. I am speaking of cultural changes, changes in our worldview.
Let me begin at a point most of us can understand. When I said WSPD is bad for Toledo I wasn’t referring only to the content of the spoken text. It is often the energy behind it that is negative. Take the simple statement: You’ve cut your hair. If I say it in a soft voice with a smile on my face you might think I like your cut. If I say those same words in a high pitched agitated voice and my eyes bugged out, I will likely convey an entirely different thought.
Brian Wilson, in both content and presentation, created negativity, whether you agreed with him or disagreed. If you disagreed you became angry at him. If you agreed, you became angry at the dumb voters and the dishonest politicians. Score one for Mr. Wilson.
Is Mr. Wilson entitled to express his opinions? Yes! But since I happened to hear his vitriolic diatribe, I merely wanted to balance out some of the negativity he created. I never expected such a response.
MickeyA…I mentioned Mr. Beck in my original post because I believe he is quite adept at manipulating his listeners. I referred to how he created an apocalyptic fear of Iran. Again I have no objection to him voicing his opinion or informing us about Iran. Energetically speaking, he devoted a great deal of time instilling fear into his listeners, not all, of course. It is a provable fact that when a person is in a state of fear (or anger) that the level of brain wave coherence is at a low point. In other words, operating in a state of fear is operating from a point of weakness. You are more susceptible to being manipulated. Also, this is why I referred WSPD when I said they helped escalate the hysteria that led to the riots in the North End, when the Nazis we in town.
Now to Fred’s challenge. My suggestions go to the heart of the matter and involve changing our worldview. Remember, I can back up everything I say.
The first problem I would address would be our educational systems. With what we’ve learned about the different levels of development the brain passes through, physiologically; how the mind and its consciousness unfolds; and the evolution of the spirit I would totally scrap our present systems. The Waldorf schools are, to my knowledge, the only system that comes close to teaching from these perspectives. There is one in Ann Arbor. I would also incorporate brain wave entrainment, brain hemispheric synchronization and a plan to reeducate parents on detrimental old worldview practices.
When it comes to governance, politics and commentary (you better sit down for this) the shift in thinking has to begin with the win/lose concept. For someone who loves sports as much as you do, you probably won’t want to get this. It is foolish and unproductive to think any one politician or party has all the answers. Yet, whatever side you are on, people buy the rhetoric of the person/party they like when they promise to solve all the problems. The reality is that the percentage of the people who didn’t vote for the winner will be dissatisfied. A certain percentage of those who voted for the winner will become disappointed. Which translates to: at any given time most of the people (exceptions noted) are dissatisfied with the person in office. This is good for your business, Fred, but not much else.
For anyone to suggest solutions as you requested is a losing proposition. None of us have held an office (exceptions noted) and few of us have run multi-million dollar organizations. You win
What I will suggest, for you of sports mentality, will seem so far in the outfield that you will have a field day criticizing it. (Is that enough sports metaphors for you?)
I would like to initiate a voluntary program that any politician could participate in that taught the latest advances in sociology and psychology on the art of interaction and the importance of discarding the win/lose mentality. I would also require council to participate in a similar program as a group.
I would also make it a law that once a month council would have to meet to discuss one contentious issue and they would not be allowed to end the meeting until a consensus (a unanimous vote) was met. Meals would be brought in, pillows and blanket too and you could only leave the room for a specified number of potty breaks. We could have the city’s population suggest issues, via computer, and council would have to pick one from the top twenty suggestions to deal with. All other activities in their lives would have to cease until a consensus was met. This would include the mayor and all parties needed to operate council.
I would challenge anyone and everyone to not tear my idea down but to improve on it. I dare you Fred.
Admit it Chico, you're Carty aren't you! LOL
Your assessment of WSPD having a role in the riots is flat out wrong. The reason the riots took place was not because of mind manipulation by a radio channel. Quite the contrary.
I'm not saying group think doesn't happen it does but you're misapplying it. I've studied it's affects first hand.
I agree with you to a certain degree about Beck about trying to stir up fear about Iran but let me play devil's advocate. In Michael Moore's film Fahrenheit 911 he showed a Marine recruiter standing in a parking lot "preying on poor kids". Not only was this untrue but Moore also lied to the Marines and told them he was going to film them for a documentary to be shown on the Discovery Channel. (BTW the Marine he filmed eventually died in Iraq)
Or this guy who claimed to have committed atrocities in Iraq? Many groups picked up on his story and tried to use his "status" as a veteran to legitimize it. He has since admitted he made false statements and that he never became a soldier but his rhetoric is still spread today as fact. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEJk7z8zQsI
These two are not only stirring up fear they're also doing irreparable harm to our military and veterans in order to spread a political message. Say what you want about Beck but he at least acknowledges his opinions are opinions and commentary. The other two spread their lies under the banner of fact.
MikeyA
MikeyA
"Also, this is why I referred WSPD when I said they helped escalate the hysteria that led to the riots in the North End, when the Nazis we in town."
Do you seriously think all those in the riots were all listening to WSPD? WSPD probably made people aware of what was coming just like every other media outlet.
But at the risk of being stereotypical, I bet the thugs trashing their neighborhood aren't faithful right-wing listeners of WSPD. Just a gut feeling,
That Robin Weirach interview today was a horrible example of bias...
...on the receiving end of much more difficult interviews, I have a much different opinion, Chris.
Robin didn't handle the interview well, to her detriment, and that certainly didn't help the situation. But the questions she got asked were the same ones asked of Latta. When both candidates are asked the same questions, where is bias?
And if you think it was Fred's attitude, well, then, all I can say is Robin 'ain't seen nothin' yet - wait 'til she gets to D.C.''
And I'm probably the only one who posts here who can say 'been there, done that' so I can say with great confidence that the intervewer wasn't bad - but the interviewee wasn't prepared, and it showed - and that's not the fault of Fred or WSPD.
(The preview is showing all one paragraph, even though my typing is showing 4...sorry if the formatting isn't correct.)
You can ask both candidates the same questions--and still skew the way the questions are asked (you obviously know this).
For instance, the question "do you support the death tax?" Well, there is no deah tax of course. It's an estate tax. The term death tax was coined by Luntz in order to change public perception. You could just as easily call it the Paris Hilton tax. So....if you ask both candidates "do you support the death tax?", the conservative would obviously say no, accepting the reframing. But the Democrat in this case rightly answered that it is an estate tax. Weirauch did a good job not to accept Fraud's reframing attempts.
There are other examples. Does WSPD keep the transcripts for these interviews? I'd love to take a look at them. Are they kept in the political public file at the station?
...in terms of death tax versus estate tax, I believe both candidates knew what was being referred to and so did the listening audience. Most people refer to it as a death tax, even if they do so wrongly. That doesn't mean the question was biased simply because it used the term 'death' versus 'estate,' especially when the candidates clearly knew what was being talked about.
As for transcripts, no. But the interviews are podcast are available on the WSPD.com website either on the front page under 'features' or on the individual show personality pages, so you can go back and listen to what was said/discussed.
Most people refer to it as a death tax
Most people? I only hear Republicans call it the "death tax". The term was coined by Republican strategist Frank Luntz only a few years back.
Is this even an issue with District 5 voters? It only affect 2% of estates.
...I've heard plenty of Democrats calling it a death tax as well.
Just because a Republican coined the term doesn't mean that the common understanding of what it's referring to represents a bias.
And it really doesn't matter how many estates are impacted - it's a concern for many family farms (and this congressional district has a lot of farms) because of how assets are counted. And even if you were to find out that you wouldn't be subjected to, that doesn't mean you're not concerned about whether or not you may qualify for such a tax in the future. I really don't know many family businesses (even farms) that hope they'll have less earnings/value as time goes on.
As for your 'republican coined the term'...does that mean that anytime a candidate uses the term 'politics of personal destruction' they're being biased against Republicans because a Democrat coined it? Guess I just see such logic as a stretch.
But you said most people called it the death tax. That's not true. Besides, the estate tax is not a concern for most family farms. It's trumped up due to efforts to reframe the issue.
Chris, I don't think it matters what you call it, so long as everyone knows what is being referred to. And Robin, in her answer, made the distinction.
The fact that Robin received the same questions as Latta is a little misleading. While the questions were the same in verbaige, the way they were delivered and the expected responses were totaly different. Being a Conservative radio program, all the questions were steered in a way so that any answer Latta gave in a simple YES/NO format were what the Host and his listening viewership wanted and expected.
These same questions answered from a Liberal stance produces results which were both controversial and rejected by the same audience.
It is these same controversies which require a more detailed response then a simple YES/NO answer; for to accept them at face value is misleading and may not represent a candidates true intentions.
Yes Fred flustered Robin with his constant bantering and baiting her into providing YES/NO answer to question in which he knew her response would be contray to what his listening audience expected. She would have been better off not calling in to this station and attempting to answer these one-sided questions.
By not allowing her a response in greater detail (which Latta did not need because all his responses were in agreement), he was able to portray her exactly as he intended and provoke the Ire of his listening audience.
I am sure his ratings will reflect this.
To me, a regular listener of WSPD and not committed to either a conservative or liberal viewpoint, I found Fred's treatment of Robin this morning typical of the "Blowhard Spin Doctors" I come to expect in any campaigh and diminished his credibility as being an objective commentator looking out for the welfare of the citizens as he portrays himself.
But as Brian Wilson would say...
But that's just me
BTW...this posting has 5 paragraphs but only displays as one. Admin, can you take a look into this bug?
...both candidates were asked to answer yes/no and both were given the opportunity after the question to explain any position or answer.
Robin just couldn't do that...having been on the other side of the situation, I know she could have given her answers in yes/no and then explained - that's what Latta did, per the rules the host set down. But you can listen to the podcast to see that both candidates were asked to do the yes/no with the opportunity to explain afterwards
And, I hope you're not saying that Robin didn't answer the questions yes/no because she knew what the listening audience wanted to hear??? I'm sure no candidate changes their answers based upon to whom they're talking. :)
And, if we're to believe what anti-war people and many polls say, most people want the troops home - so that isn't a questioned designed to provoke a controversial answer that would be rejected by the listeners.
Some people run a radio station with talk shows.They took the call letters of WSPD.
Some other people have this opinion that free speech only means free speech FOR them and anyone who doesn't share THEIR own beliefs has no right to speak.
Well, that's not how it works. If YOU do not like what's going on with a radio station - start your own. Somebody else owns this one.
If you don't like what they have to say you have every right not to listen. But they still have the right to speak.
Talk about eroding civil liberties. The new great 'entitled' class holds forth. Cater to them or be persecuted, called names and typical junior high shaming games will be used.
God save us.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
I remember the first time I heard you interviewed on the radio. Dare I say Denny Schafer? My first impression of you was not good. I thought you were arrogant and snippy. But it didn't take me long to figure out that you were just being assertive. I've said before on these blogs and I tell a lot of people I converse with " I LIKE MAGGIE ! "
First impressions are very important when candidates are trying to get my vote. Robin's was just horrible. Even her 2nd (on the radio) and the 3rd (on Cocklin & Company) did not go well. Unfortunately this was election day and she won't get a another chance with the voters. She alone screwed that up. Not Fred.
Let me just say here that I get my news and information from the Internet, WSPD, and a few local publications. Radio is the best way to get in depth information to form opinions of political candidates. and did I say I like Maggie?
Although I didn't listen to, and pprobably won't, either interview I am familiar with the techniques Fred uses to acheive a desired result. Maggie, in all probability you will have to work overtime if you start to take on the role of "logical defender" for the Dynamic Duo, Brian Wilson and his intellectual Mini-me, Fred. (I use these terms endearingly.) BTW, why hasn't Fred responded to my last comment? Is he afraid to actually have a true discussion on a level playing field? FRED, WHERE ARE YOU?.
WSPD - We Stand for Prehistoric Diatribes... LOL
defending Robin or Fred. I offered my opinion based upon having been the 'interviewee' more times than anyone who posts here and more times than Robin.
Preconceived ideas about the people involved cannot help but influence your perspective of the interview - and I'll apply that to me as well.
But, with my own experience being questioned on positions, thoughts, ideas, etc... I do not believe that Fred was harsh or mean in the interview. And I'll go back to what I said on air last night - and here...if you and Robin think this was tough, then she's certainly not ready for the types of questions she'd get if she was elected.
I commented on this at the start of Eye on Toledo last night (http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18227/1h/cchannel.download.akamai.com/1...) and challenged those who called in to Fred and Brian to call in and discuss it with me - having been in Robin's position. No one did.
All I can say is that I, too, heard the interviews and, being the only one here (that I know of) who's been in the same position as Robin - it wasn't anywhere as bad as many are making it out to be. And that's my opinion/perspective...
I downloaded the podcast of your show and listened to it. I have to say that your analysis of Robin's interview was just as biased as the interview itself.
...opinions are, by their very nature, biased to some degree or another...
:)
In fact I would say profound. Not one thought can be thought , one word said that is not influenced by the sum of our experiences. If this idea became a consensus reality the world would be a very different place. To take this thought to its logical conclusion one could even say there is no right or wrong, only opinions, only concensus realties. Would you agree?
Not one thought can be thought , one word said that is not influenced by the sum of our experiences. If this idea became a consensus reality the world would be a very different place.
Agree...
To take this thought to its logical conclusion one could even say there is no right or wrong, only opinions, only concensus realties.
Disagree - I believe there are some absolutes. Murder, for instance, the way it is defined today, is wrong. (killing in self-defense is not defined as murder today) I think stealing is wrong, no matter what the circumstances.
There are many things that can be defined as wrong as an absolute, regardless of your opinion on them. The way I'd address such things is to allow compassion for the circumstances resulting in violating such absolutes to be incorporated into the punishment. For instance - in the example of stealing. If you steal, it's wrong. If the reason you were stealing was because you were literally starving, you might garner compassion for the excuse and your penalty for doing so might be less as a result, but it doesn't make the act any less wrong.
My two cents...
I thought you might go in this direction. Your own words will help me make my point. When you say that murder…the way it is defined today, is wrong aren’t you are implying that the definition of murder can change.
Would an absolute change according to cultural norms? The Japanese warrior culture placed honor above the taking of human life. What we would consider murder and suicide were acceptable and necessary to preserve honor. Ancient cultures killed thousands to appease the Gods.
Today, we also have examples where the taking of life in not considered murder. We have one government believing it is acceptable to take out a leader of another country. We even have a “Christian” conservative minister (Pat Robinson) saying we should assassinate Hugo Chavez. We have mercenary organizations (Blackwater) that can take the lives of unarmed civilians because we value the lives of our diplomats more. Also, how many unarmed civilians, including children, have been killed in Iraq only to be referred to as collateral damage? I could go on.
Our definition of murder is a consensus reality and not an absolute because there are socially acceptable exceptions.
Personally, I would like it if it were an absolute. Also, bear in mind, that this doesn’t necessarily lessen the importance or the validity of a culturally held consensus reality. I could also make a similar argument for stealing, if you’d like.
My point is this: Believing in absolute rights and wrongs can remove personal responsibility for ones action. Which is why Pat Robinson can believe it is right to murder Hugo Chavez or why a woman can be punished for being raped.
Also understanding that consensus realities are cultural choices will make it easier for us to adapt to shifts in our thinking as the world changes.
"When you say that murder…the way it is defined today, is wrong aren’t you are implying that the definition of murder can change."
I used this phrasology in order to not get into defining involuntary manslaughter, and other such 'killings' that are not intentionally taking a life with premeditation or in a fit of anger...not to imply the definition is changeable.
Just because Pat Robinson believes it is right to murder Hugo Chavez does not mean that murder is 'right.' Using examples of individuals who advocate murder does not make the absolute of 'murder' any less an absolute.
I'm also one who believes that some cultural practices are wrong - even if they are 'correct' or 'right' within that culture. Punishing a woman because a bunch of men raped her is a good example. Simply because some culture believes it is the proper way to deal with the situation does not mean that the rest of the world - or other people, in general, would agree - and it doesn't make the act of rape any less 'wrong.' In this case, you're confusing punishment and how it is meted out with the 'crime' or the 'wrong' of the act which precipitated the punishment.
War is another matter entirely and much of the 'right and wrong' of defense of self and country is rooted in individual religious teachings/beliefs.
I don't agree that believing in absolute rights and wrongs removes responsibility for one's action. In fact, I think just the opposite. If murder is wrong, you should be held accountable for committing it - not exempted from the judicial process ... now, if your circumstances are such that some sort of 'extenuating circumstances' led to the murder, the penalty can be modified and meted with compassion or understanding ... but that doesn't change the fact that you were held accountable - even if it was in a different way from someone else.
"RIYADH, Saudi Arabia - Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah
has pardoned a female rape victim who had been sentenced to 200 lashes
for being alone with a man at the time of the attack who was not
related to her, a Saudi newspaper reported Monday."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071217/ap_on_re_mi_ea/saudi_justice;_ylt=A0...
"I'm also one who believes that some cultural practices are wrong"
Who is to say what is right and wrong in another culture, when our culture has enough baggage to fill many bags.
"Simply because some culture believes it is the proper way to deal with
the situation does not mean that the rest of the world - or other
people, in general, would agree"
And conversely because some culture feels that it is wrong is not a reason for disapproval.
Many of these events are isolated and are not reflective of the greater culture.
http://toledoohioneighborhoodconcerns.com/blog
Excellent response! I am willing to concede that you believe the act of taking a life voluntarily, with intention, premeditated or in a fit of anger to be an absolute act of murder that can carry different levels of accountability given the circumstances. On this we are in agreement. The difference we have is, IMO, mankind has not yet evolved to the level of consciousness where, in our culture, murder is an absolute wrong. We have far too many examples of the taking of a life as you’ve defined as murder where it is not treated as such. It is because we have socially acceptable exceptions that our definition of murder is a consensus reality.
Unfortunately, even if war begins as a conflict of religious (or even philosophical) rights or wrongs all too often it involves “acceptable” forms of murder in that there is no accountability. (The most recent examples can be found in Jeremy Scahill’s “Blackwater”) There are even examples where the U.S. has committed murder in countries with whom we have not been at war. (Confessions of an Economic Hit Man by John Perkins)
I am not confusing crime and punishment. I wanted to expand the scope of our discussion to include the act of what we call capital punishment, which following the criteria above would be murder. Do you believe in capital punishment?
As I said earlier, I am willing to believe that you believe murder is an absolute. It is entirely possible that you are sufficiently evolved in your thinking that murder is murder and there are no exceptions. However, in our world too many people have accepted the consensus reality of murder, with the culturally accepted exceptions, as an absolute and thus they avoid the necessity of examining and perhaps reevaluating their worldview as mankind struggles to collectively raise its level of consciousness
Sorry for the delayed response. Somehow I missed your comments untill now. I hope you read this. I would suggest you read my comments carefully and don't read into it that which is not there. MikeyA...when you say that the reason the riots took place was not because of mind manipulation.... I agree with you. WSPD did not cause the riot. Thomas...Do I think all those in the riots we all listening to WSPD? Of course not!
Can either of you say that not one person who listened to and was informed by WSPD showed up that day? That is all I'm saying. None of us can say how many people showed up because they listened to WSPD.
I am familiar with the psychological behavior of a crowd that riots. It has been studied and reported for decades.
Since I was not there the actions and reactions that took place that day are not known to me. What I am saying is that WSPD informed enough people that they added to the total number of people that showed up. They also motivated emough people in a variety of ways. (pro-nazi, anti-nazi or just curiosoty seekers) What happened once people showed up is a matter I have not addressed.
"Can either of you say that not one person who listened to and was informed by WSPD showed up that day? That is all I'm saying. None of us can say how many people showed up because they listened to WSPD."
Is WSPD the only local media outlet in Toledo? Nope. All of Toledo's media - the Blade, Tv stations....- reported the news Nazi's were coming.
Even spreading the blame to the entire media is ridiculous. People are still responsible for their own actions. The defense, "I saw it on TV!" isn't going to hold up in court.
Thats like saying i saw illegals crossing the border on TV, went and shot one, but it's the tv network's fault.
No.
I will concede that had the media as a whole given the riot a blackout then we would not have had the riots.
However your analysis neglects to note that the Nazi's did return and did receive media attention on their return, including WSPD's attention. But the reaction was decidedly different.
The difference was the government's reaction. JaFord's administration did NOTHING to protect the people. When the Nazi's returned it was under the Carty administration and the Nazi's were told to demonstrate on public grounds and not in a neighborhood. Also adequate protection by the police insured there was no overreaction by the community. Therein lies the difference.
MikeyA
MikeyA