Secondhand Bacon

Personally, I'm through listening to any of these so-called 'experts'.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/6560121.stm

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for decades. We don't eat them as a rule, once in a great - great while in a soup or something. But it is not news that nitrate additives are toxic to humans.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

Personally, I'm through listening to any of these so-called 'experts'.

Why? It's no secret our bodies weren't designed to deal with the myriad of chemicals we expose it to on a daily basis. It's also no big surprise that some of these chemicals have negative effects.

I bet you listened to them when it was discovered some of our pets have renal failure due to a chemical in their food. I bet you wouldn't insulate your house with asbestos if it were legal to do so. I would be willing to bet you wouldn't let your wife drink alcohol or smoke crack while she was pregnant. So are you only selectively believing what they tell you? Only when it's convenient or makes sense?

I love to be contrary when people do stupid things. I can't actually believe your wives drank alcohol while they were pregnant.....and sound somewhat proud about it too! I have no patience with people who put their future kids at risk, and drinking alcohol while pregnant does that. Why don't you give your wife some thalidomide too? Idiot.

I think I am correct in assuming that Darkseid is retired. This would likely mean that his wife was pregnant when smoking and drinking was acceptable and less was known about the hazards.

Having taught anatomy and physiology I often experienced first hand student's frustrations at the myriad and often contradictory reports on health issues.

When MY mother was pregnant the doctor asked her to take up smoking to help control her weight.

A friend of the family is currently expecting - any day now and one doctor told her to have a glass of 'white' wine now and again that it was healthy while another told her to avoid alcohol entirely.

There isn't some kind of instruction manual - and apparently all the dr's either don't get the same training or they don't buy into it.

A friend of mine was treated for a painful lump in her breast for the better part of a year with anti-biotics because 'cancer doesn't hurt'. And the doctor truly believed that right up until the radical mastectomy was scheduled.

Pobody's Nerfect :-)

I think most things in moderation are ok for you so long as your system is healthy enough to get rid of the impurities.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

heyhey - don't be so self-righteous. I smoked & took codeine & aspirin through all 3 of my pregnancies, and all turned out healthy, of good birth weight - and still are healthy. When I was pregnant - they actually brought ashtrays into the labor & hospital room. Nobody ever heard of fetal alcohol syndrome, although I really didn't drink, and nobody said anything about smoking while pregnant. How dare you dump your smugness on others - especially since these "hazards" weren't even recognised back then. I did have a concern about a drug I was put on for nausea, for two of my pregnancies - I'd read an article saying that it could cause deformities. When I asked my doctor, he said it was only in the British drug, not what he prescribed. Turned out - it was the same drug, they ended up taking it off the market. So basically - the doctor approved & prescribed drug was more likely to cause birth defects than anything I consumed. So, go screw yourself heyhey.

You're right katie - doctors were MORE concerned with weight gain back then. On my third pregnancy, the ob actually wanted me to gain a bit more weight (same ob/gyn's as the other two) - so different than the first two pregnancies where they cautioned me to not gain more than 20 pounds.

And my older sister actually LOST 7 pounds during her last pregnancy - & I remember telling her about an article I read that if the mom to be didnt gain enough weight, it could cause learning problems in the child. I DO see signs of learning problems in her (now grown) son - but her doctor was thrilled she didnt gain weight. Go figure.

I don't deny that medical science advances very rapidly and that previous generations made mistakes and that we continue to make mistakes. The key is that you use the best information you have at this point (because that's all we can go on). Does alcohol cause FAS? Yes, without a doubt. Do tanning beds cause cancer? Yes, without a doubt (tanning beds emit VERY powerful radiation and that's the cause of the increase in melanoma today; it used to be incredibly rare). Does smoking cause emphysema and COPD among other things? Yes, without a doubt. Does thalidomide cause birth defects? Yes, without a doubt. Did DDT cause bird shells to be abnormally thin? Yes, without a doubt. Did the banning of DDT actually cost millions of people their lives? Yes, without a doubt.

The point of all this is that everything advances. Just because a doctor told your mom X number of years ago to smoke while she was pregnant doesn't make that doctor right. Remember that doctors used to "bleed" their patients years and years ago too.

I wasn't "dumping my smugness" on Darkseid because of his wife drinking alcohol. Especially if the risks weren't known then. We started to learn about FAS in the 70s, so by the 80s it was common knowledge. What I got mad about was that he sounded proud of the fact that his wife drank alcohol and I'm sure he would support the "right" of a pregnant woman to be drink everyday if they wanted to now. It's like a badge of honor or something to stand against the establishment even though standing up against the establishment puts undue risks on your future child. Who cares about the consequences to the unborn child, right?

I appreciate most of the personal freedom topic Darkseid brings up. Most of them are seemingly common sense stands that government is trying to restrict. But often times when he mentions the topics of food or drink or whatever that cause health problem he immediately casts them away becaues "my grandpa used to do that every day!" That's probably true, but your average grandpa also lived 10 years less than the average grandpa does today. All this article says is that processed meats contain nitrates for preservation and those nitrates cause health problems. Big surprise there, really. So my questions is why have you had it with these "experts?" Do you deny their findings? Do you think they just made this up to make the paper? Or do you not listen to them simply because they say something that might lead to changes in the eating habits of Americans?

...and the frustration of trying to figure it all out. Years ago, they said that butter was bad for you (fat and cholesterol) and that you should use margarine, instead. Now they say that margarine contains lots of chemicals and trans-fats and they're bad for you, so you shouldn't use the margarine you switched to.

Personally, I use butter, figuring that the natural ingredients are better than any chemicals or artificially created ingredients. But I'm sure that something will come up in the future showing that butter is, again, bad for you...or still bad for you...

But I'm also reminded of a sci-fi movie I once saw...They'd go back in the past to airplanes that were about to crash and take the people off the plane and into the future - leaving dead 'future people' in the seats...When sending their agents back into the past to prepare, they told the agents to smoke cigarettes...interesting take on things..and who's to say it isn't within the realm of possibilities?

and who's to say it isn't within the realm of possibilities?

meaning that some day what's bad for us may end up being good for us - not the time travel thing (although that would be really interesting!)

I am not reading dark as being upset about the information so much as when something new does come along - someone wants to legislate the matter and set rules and regulations for everyone with a broad sweep of the brush.

It great to have knowledge so people, who WISH TO DO SO, may make more informed decisions. But this is America. You can choose to be as well informed or as ignorant as you choose.

I figure your grandparents lived in the mid 19th. century if my math is right.

They had less stress and bs then?

It think it is all relative to what we make it.

We look back and say the good ol days. Pumping water by hand, no proper sanitation, lack of food at times, early death by some and disease, etc.

Same but different?

http://toledoohioneighborhoodconcerns.com/blog

That would put them around 1850? The last century was the 20th - dark isn't that old.

You're right neighborhood about the stress but they had more heart disease - that is for sure, that couldn't be resolved medically.

The heart disease that took my grandparents was corrected surgically in my Dad.

Same but better in many ways.

Anybody happen to know about margarine my son says they learned in chemistry that this substance first came about as a waste product from some kind of plastic manufacturing and they tried to put it in cattle feed and the cattle refused it. Also that it is almost a plastic in its' chemical makeup and they put flavor in it to make it taste like butter?

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

Touche.

It was much too early when I figured the era's out.

Thanks for the clarification

http://toledoohioneighborhoodconcerns.com/blog

both drank alcohol and smoked while they were pregnant-for all the kids. All five turned out fine. You love to be contrary-don't you?

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

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'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

just go f**k yourself? Take some poison yourself, Idiot. The world would be a better place. It was drinking in MODERATION. You're probably all for abortion, though. The same liberals usually are.

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

A voice of reason. Yes, you're correct in your assumptions, but I still today don't feel that smoking or drinking LIGHTLY is going to have an effect. All three of my Daughters have smoked and drank in moderation while pregnant, and no Grandchild has a problem either. A lot of things depend on your genes, and there's really nothing much you can do about that. I feel that science does more to needlessly frighten people sometimes. I don't recall people dropping over like flies back then-in fact-I'd only known two people that died of cancer by the time I was in my thirties, and everything was 'unhealthier' back then. Today,with all the 'health is God' hysteria- EVERYBODY is getting cancer-why?
I do wish the troll would simply stay out of my threads, since we already know we don't like each other (to put it mildly). If I see he's started a thread, I avoid it like the plague. Therefore, problem solved.

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

all those damned years I gave up tasty butter and ate margarine (later it was doctor-reccommended I Can't Believe It's Not Butter), and now the scumbags say that it was worse for me-but it's too late. And, yeah.,
the legislation/scare part does tick me off more.

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

He/She is either a 1). Doctor. 2). Nurse. 3). Med Student.

If not one of those three, then something else to do with the health industry. You can take it to the bank. At NO time did I advocate anyone getting drunk every day while expecting.
And our Grandfathers may have died ten years earlier, but they sure as hell died happier and lived with far less bullshit and stress.

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

Your body can process butter. It can't process margarine properly because it doesn't know what to do with it. Therefore some of it (I don't profess to know what percentage) just hangs around.

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BRING THE TROOPS HOME-NOW!
Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

Nope, I'm as pro-life as you can get. I'm also a medical student and know that it has been shown any amount of alcohol can cause Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. That's why the Surgeon General recommends complete abstinence from alcohol use during a pregnancy. Is having that beer once a month worth a 10% risk of having a child with FAS? Absolutely not.

of what I said above-pulled this off the internet.

"The incidence of melanoma of the skin is rising faster than any other major cancer in the United States. In 2002

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'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

My grandfather had a garden (about two acres) from which he raised green (and shell) beans for himself, his wife, and whoever came to visit. His pride (and safety net) was the root cellar in which he had canned (in glass jars) beans going back seven years. He always gave to anyone who had need. And when he worked his "garden" he always wore a brimmed straw hat, pants, and long sleeved shirts (no matter how hot it got in southern Kentucky.

I believe it was modesty (the fundamentalists down there have more in common with Muslims that we do today), but it also had the added effect that it shielded them from the sun (and skin cancer). He finally died from cancer (of the lung). I guess it just so happened he was a smoker (but it could have been from working in the coal mine he dug along with friends to feed their families during the Depression).

"Tanning" is something that has only been a big deal, I think, since the 1930s. Before that various religious groups and cultures (the Puritans, and Victorians, among them) held sway.

People were also practical then. I doubt you would have seen young girls walking around with their coats over their arms to the elbow, and off their chest, and freezing their asses off to look "cute" or "sexy".

Old South End Broadway

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