Well nine weeks later and TPS is right back where they started. What will they do next?
Harner declines TPS offer!
By sflagg - Posted on April 24th, 2007
Well nine weeks later and TPS is right back where they started. What will they do next?
should reconsider their options and begin talks with Foley.
He's smartly positioned himself perfectly for this moment so they should just bite the proverbial bullet and "Get 'er done..."
P.S.
I believe I predicted that Foley would have the upper hand, if/when negotiations with Harner failed.
;-)
Hooda Thunkit
April 30th they will meet to decide what to do next. Report coming.
http://toledopoliticians.com/4_24_07_tps_board_meeting
Audio starts at the announcement (well 1:30 in)
I'm listening now...a lot of "shifting". I wish Ms. Jackish would get "shifted" away from Old Orchard...
Until the lion writes his own story, the tale of the hunt will always glorify the hunter (African proverb)
Until the lion writes his own story, the tale of the hunt will always glorify the hunter (African proverb)
You are sure welcome but tonight is all Chris. I thought the school board meeting was next Tuesday. :-(
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
Here is the report, very weak but this is it:
First I got there after citizen comments and mostly through executive session around 6:30 or so. Apparently things got hot when Larry Sykes threatened to arrest Claudia Cooper for something. I did not see it, maybe someone can elaborate. Due needing to accomplish some tasks for tomorrow, I could not make it on time. They came back around 7 or so and made the announcement that Harner withdrew his name.
Then with union input, AFSME said that they wondered when they were going to get a new levy because workers are tired of not having raises and they are paying more than ever.
The only other main thing that was discussed was a resolution supporting putting the (wrongly labeled) constitutional school funding amendment on the ballot. The group wanted boards to support it so that the district can go out and get signatures. Darlene Fisher asked some questions about the amendment questioning it. It passed 4 to 1 with Fisher the dissenting vote.
The sad thing about the whole meeting was the negotiations fell through
I may have beat you to the wire on that prediction, but maybe not.
You'd have to be blind not to see the hand that hit the 'replay' button here.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
Now that the charade is over and Sykes and Steel do not have to pretend like they were seriously considering Mr. Harner any longer they will go ahead and give the job to Mr. Foley. This was the plan from the start with the sanction of Ms. Noeske.
I am really pissed that I went to the public forums at 7:30 in the morning to meet the candidates thinking that the process would be fair, if the public was watching.
I have attended and taken part in the entire process to get a new superintendent, other than the one Sanders left behind to guard the henhouse.
Does the public really care about what is taking place On Manhattan?
What is wrong in Toledo that we settle on being a city "of the future." Why don't we want a "right now city" that we and our children can prosper in?
As long as TPS keeps doing the same old stuff the same old way there will always be the Ms. Jackish's in the school system destroying the futures of our children.
We adults have to carry the load for our children and get the bad apples out of our public schools, from the board president to the interim superintendent on down.
We need to send a STRONG message, if you ain't for us-- you agin us!!!!
None of these people are for us or our children, it's all about the money!!!!
NO LEVY!!!!
I've watched Foley for years and he has the problem of if you don't sing the praises of the district and if you identify an issue that requires attention then you can't be our friend. This mentality needs to change - If you are not talking our praises, you have to be an enemy. I think Foley is probably viewed as a nice guy by many, but the real test of character and leadership is when you deal with people that disagree or perhaps you don't like or when you have to tackle a controversial issue. Foley is old school.
I will say this; Foley was not treated well during the process of announcing who the board wanted. I've mentioned my reasons in past posts. For many it will take a lot of pride swallowing to accept the job. I will leave it to others to decide what this says about Foley if he accepts the job. Frankly he would be better off financially by retiring in July with 30 years and finding another job (there are 4 super positions open in Toledo area last I looked). He could easily bring down more than a quarter million and perks by double dipping while leaving all his problems behind.
I think this whole episode says volumes about this board and the leadership of Barnett, Sykes and Steel. It is interesting that two of these three appear to be lame ducks. Barnett says she is not running. Sykes has not announced, but he is not even seeking the endorsement of the Democratic Party which could be implied as "not running". Why would they let Sykes head up these negotiations? He dragged out the process for over ten weeks and based upon his lack of support of Harner undoubtedly worked to make this day happen.
A real soap opera at Manhattan and Elm - the biggest smile of the night was on Sykes' face. He appeared real happy with the results....Hmmmmm....
There are a lot of reasons to get negotiations done quickly after a decision to hire is made. This type of situation is more likely to occur the longer it drags out. Events crop up in a ten week plus time frame that can complicate a decision such as Paul Vallas' decision on April 12 - http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home_top_left_story/20070412_Vallas_to_le...
Harner undoubtedly is a strong candidate to replace Vallas - much larger salary, does not have to move and uproot his family, knows the district and problems, etc.
If this deal had been done in March as it should have been, my belief is Harner would have been signed.
Larry Sykes was responsible for the negotiations in 2000 and they let him lead the negotiations this time. He never wanted Harner and he got his way through delay.
We need to demand that Sykes and the board tell us what really happened. It does not look good for this district to keep bungling "everything". Is it any wonder with leadership like this in this city that everyone is leaving. What is the old adage - you don't want to be the last one out turning off the lights. What a shame!
My Uncle lives in Southgate - my son and I drove up there a few weeks ago for a concert and he drove us to the concert hall. At a light headed back out of town another driver and my Uncle hollered to each other and laughed 'don't forget to shut out the lights'.
It's a striking commentary to those who are in positions of trust an hour south of Detroit to be playing the same political games that lead to such devastation in Detroit. The public schools here in Toledo are headed for the rocks and it is a statement about the character of those who would put meeting their own special interests ahead of correcting the course of the district.
These aren't the types of folks you would want your kid talking to let alone making decisions about their education.
I think it's time to discuss plan 'B'.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
totally confused. This whole mess reeks of dead fish and backroom deals.
I do have to agree somewhat with LisaRenee about the true evaluation of Harner's willingness to stay with the District if he was offered something else AFTER he was hired here. But now we will never know if that is on target or not.
Foley seems to be a nice man, but I am not convinced that he has what it takes to make the hard decisions, stand by them, and survive the fallout associated with such a task. We need a no-nonsense, take no prisoners type of superintendent that has the stuff to stand up to the demons.
The idea that this devastating news is released and the next 'comment' is from AFSCME asking for more money.......well, that just tells me that they (AFSCME) don't care what happens to the district as long as they get their dollars. That leads me to believe that they don't give two hoots about the district, the schools, or the kids.
I am just beside myself. I feel like I'm stuck watching a bad movie - over and over and over....
AND - the next time I hear "it's for the kids" as an excuse for a levy??? I'm probably going to need bail money!
We're asking for correspondence regarding the negotiations with Harner through an open records request. We'll publish the data when we get it!
Question. How was it obvious to you that Harner was not the right fit? Were you involved in any of the Public Forums that TPS had to question and talk to the three candidates?
While Harner was not my first choice, he was my second. I was involved in the interview process and was very impressed with the answers to all of the questions.
First of all he said that the mission was first. The mission are the children. He stated that he had just met with the unions and that they were concerned about their safety. He said that they can not lose sight of the mission and that is to educate the children.
I asked him about diversity in the teaching ranks. He was stunned that this question was even asked as he said that diversity was very important in a school system. In the district where he was, he said that there were only three minority teachers in a student population of minorities (Hispanic). Within a short amount of time he had increased the minority teaching staff to 16 (mainly men and Hispanic). He said that he didn't care how it happened or where they came from, all children need minority teachers, Men, Black, Hispanic and he would see to it that Toledo recruited more minority teachers.
So for him not to be a good fit would require the mindset and the culture of exclusion that would require TPS to stay the same, approximately 12,000 black students, 200 black teachers, 43 hispanic teachers out of a pool of 1598, of which 400 are male. These numbers are atrocious! Harner would have had a fight but he would have changed that!
50,000 days of suspension which is punitive and does not change behavior and no end in sight. He was committed to change that.
The way that the media twists the news is appalling. "Harner turns down Toledo," when in actuality Toledo turned down Harner. To get Foley!
I talked to a former superintendent who was superintendent in 4 major districts in the United States and he said the following about negotiations:
1. His negotiation usually took 1-3 weeks to sign a contract, because both parties wanted him hired.
2. He said while 8 weeks is not unusual, that may be a sign there are problems that is what takes so long, but not necessarily. Detroit took 8 weeks to sign their candidate.
3. Sometimes when things seem difficult a superintendent candidate, they will get cold feet if they sense a bad political environment.
So the unanswered questions are:
1. Who gave the hard time? How much responsibility did the board have delaying things?
2. Did Harner sense something going on and decided it was not worth it?
3. Did the resignation of Vallas factor in?
4. What agreement was TAAP referring to? They got their percentage raises, TFT and AFSME did not.
My own belief is that Mr. Harner had the respect to bring together different parts of the community. It is a shame things did not work out. I have nothing against Foley, but it is healthy for an organization as large as TPS to have outside thoughts.
If I am a betting man, I would wager we have not heard the end of this.
When did anyone ever receive an announcement that they had been selected as the 'pick' for a job...wait around for a month or more and then have to make an offer TO the hiring party?
I'm just asking because one of my skills is business consulting - and have been consulting for years for a select few clients - NONE of us have ever heard of this practice.
Have you?!
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
I think it is sad Mr. Sykes is making the comments about Harner in today's Blade. He is a professional guy and it is not appropriate for him to say it was a result of Harner's demands. This is the exact same excuse Sykes said last time negotiations fell through. Knowing Sykes he would be the one who probably was making the unreasonable demands.
I did not know the answer to the question, which is why I asked.
As stated, he was my second choice and I felt that he would start the process of change.
We all know that the media drives a person's opinion. It is better to me but not always possible to actually talk to the person and get a feel for what they are about.
Whatever "Harnergate" is or was, the fact that he had the courage to discipline a teacher is unique.
I don't expect everyone to understand this statement but I just returned from a suspension hearing where the teacher just outright lied (on paper, didn't have to courage to attend and lie face to face to the parent) and should be disciplined, but that won't happen.
I've been looking at discipline stats lately. I very well understand the statement.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
This comment is from todays Blade article. And I am truly confused now.
"Residency was the issue and where his daughter would go to school," Mr. Sykes said. "We were not going to agree to let him live in Ottawa Hills, ..."
And this makes sense why??? The TEACHERS don't have to live in the district, so why would the Super? If residency is a requirement, then TPS better start making darned sure that the teachers live IN the district and they don't send their own children to private/parochial schools!
This truly sounds like more Sykes BS to me!
Ok, guess where THIS poster is as he comments about a school levy???
"I would gladly pay extra $250 a year for my son's tuition. I would not gladly pay extra $1000 every year for a failed school system which I do not use, which is being run by the ideologically-driven idiots who year after year have been abusing taxpayer's generosity, showed their utter inability to run the district in a cost-effective manner, who polarized already divided community, and who sabotaged every effort to make the district more cost effective and in line with the demands of the day."
(Hint - Cleveland.....
751.2.2.1.1.1. Faulty logic
by WilliamLion, 3/23/07 15:56 ET
Re: A thing or two (Part 2)... by stimulus, 3/23/07
http://www.cleveland.com/forums/clevelandheights/index.ssf)
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
From what I've read in the Blade Harner was hired, and then negotiations began on his compensation package. I've always known what I would receive before I took a job. It seems rather unprofessional to me.
Of course, we aren't talking about professionals, but rather the Board of Education of TPS. I am assuming that Mr. Harner thought he was wanted badly enough that he could write his own ticket, and the Board decided, belatedly, otherwise.
Where does that leave the taxpayer? Mr. Foley, being human, could put the screws to the Board. He was passed over for someone who looked "better", but who was too expensive (both financially and in the loss of prestige to the "leaders" in the community). Do we really need a "leader", or just a fall guy when things begin to go badly next time there is an "education crisis"? How much do you compensate some fool for that? Maybe we are all better off just letting one parent quit his/her own job, and homeschooling the brats.
Old South End Broadway
Foley is already putting the screws to the district, at least the part of the district that I live in!
WTOL has the story. WSPD too I think.
If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.
I couldn't agree more. He's not just the candidate of last resort. He's more than qualified for the job and, I believe, has a passion for TPS and Toledo that will drive him to succeed.
Until the lion writes his own story, the tale of the hunt will always glorify the hunter (African proverb)
Until the lion writes his own story, the tale of the hunt will always glorify the hunter (African proverb)
That Harner wasn't the right fit for Toledo, and had he been hired? Would have been another one of those that jumped ship at a better opportunity rather than one interested in making a commitment to the Toledo Area. Which is not a cut at Harner, I can understand with him already in that area wanting a job closer to where he is now and it appears he's going to have the chance. I also realize many of these School Board Superintendents don't seem to stay in one area for very long. I think that is a problem because by the time they get up to speed with knowing the district and it's unique problems? If they start looking for another job, we are again left with starting over and wasting more time getting the next Super up to speed. We really don't know all of the reasons why Harner said he was no longer interested, all we can do is speculate but, I was not impressed with his "stayability" even before he was selected as their top choice.
I think it's unfortunate 9 weeks were wasted but it's not the end of the world. Realistically it saved us the hassle of hiring him then going thru all of this again as soon as his contract was nearing it's end or if he was allowed out of it early.
We don't even know if they are going to start all over again, as Larry Sykes hinted on the news last night, and the Blade states:
Board member Larry Sykes, who was involved in the negotiations, said it would be difficult to look again at the pool of candidates who applied previously.
That would by virtue of the way that's phrased apply to Foley as well. Yet, that is also only one quote by Sykes and we don't know how the other board members feel.
We don't remember days only moments...
I wasn't involved in the screening of Harner, I did my research, which included this:
http://www.wyff4.com/education/3244450/detail.html
and much deeper...He also is a supporter of NCLB, even testifying before the House.
Since he left the Military he was a principal for only two years then went to Greenville, where he was asked to resign, then ended up in his current position, where he has not been for very long before he decided to apply here.
So, while you may have met him and thought he was great, on paper he did not impress me and I did not want another Super that demonstrated he was only going to be around until the next best offer came.
We don't remember days only moments...
State law says the district cannot do this. Why would Mr. Sykes want to require this? Sounds like an excuse to have an argument to get someone to give up.
I thought since you attended the interviews, you knew I wasn't a part of the process, which is why I stated it that way.
I am learning more about the discipline issues, and I agree with you that more needs to be done. If a teacher can't attend a hearing and be questioned, it does not appear to be a very fair process.
We disagree on the aspect of it being okay to discipline a teacher for expressing their opinion in a newspaper. That doesn't mean I think there doesn't need to be a better discipline process here, but everyone should have the ability to speak out without fear of being disciplined for expressing their right to free speech.
We don't remember days only moments...
If you are not familiar with the superintendent hiring process you don't know that most searches across the country do not regulary include a salary in any advertisement. Salary is usually a part of contract negotiations.
If I had to pick one thing that made me think he wasn't someone I wanted? Beyond the whole "Harnergate" that I read about in Greenville, the fact that he reportedly disciplined a teacher for writing a letter that was critical to a local newspaper made me feel he did not exhibit the type of personality I thought was a mix. Then this:
School trustees and parent groups at odds with Harner frequently said he angered them by not consulting them before making major decisions, such as changing school start times or proposing school closings. Harner couldn't be reached Tuesday to comment.
We don't remember days only moments...
From what I was told when I asked about this, you cannot make a law requiring residency but it can be a contract demand, if the person agrees to that as a contract term then they would be in breech of the contract if they later did not follow it.
The law that was thrown out was one that allowed Cities to make a blanket requirement that employees or certain categories of employees had to live within the City limits.
Basically - you can't force someone to obey this, unless they have entered into a contract with that as a specific requirement is the way it was explained to me.
We don't remember days only moments...
I think you left some information out when you "screened" Harner. The Greenville County Schools website provides more information about what he accomplished during his 4 year tenure at the 64,000 student district. The average tenure of a superintendent in the US BTW is 2-3 years.
http://www.greenville.k12.sc.us/district/admin/super/archive/index.asp
After four years in Greenville he went to Gainesville City Schools in Georgia for two years as a middle school principal for a Title 1/minority school of 1000 and made great strides in raising the academic bar for all students. He was also the Secondary Programs Director. Since October he has been at the Philadelphia City Schools as Assistant Superintendent and working for the CEO.
I am sure this is just some of the reasons why he was selected by the board to lead the TPS into a new era. Success for all students.
Good link, thanks. It seemed like Harner was so committed, what could have gone wrong? I wonder if he would reconsider if the board offered.