African American Parents’ Association along with ABLE will hold a Parent's Forum

African American Parents’ Association

1807 W. Bancroft

Toledo, Ohio 43607

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Event: Suspension/Expulsion Forum
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Place: Scott High School Cafeteria

2400 Collingwood

Toledo, Ohio 43620
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Date: April 10, 2008
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Time: 6:30PM-8:00PM
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During Toledo Public School’s school year 2005-2006 over 50,000 days of school were lost to students due to suspension and expulsions. Because being out of school affects a student’s learning, the African American Parents’ Association and Advocates for Basic Legal Equality (ABLE) will hold a Public Forum to advise parents on what steps to follow when their student is suspended or expelled.
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The Forum will be divided into four segments: 1. Know the rules, 2. Know the law, 3. Know your rights and 4. Know how to effectively advocate for your student.
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Parents, guardians, grandparents and the public are invited.
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For Further Information contact: Twila Page 419-243-3813

Charles Brown 419-535-3075

Attorney Ryan Wilson 419-255-0814

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Your rating: None Average: 2 (3 votes)

FOLLOW the RULES ??????????????????

Since the Mudhens were cancelled tonight, I sit here and wonder how the forum went?

Any insight for parents?
Good attendence?

I had another commitment. But I did see some of the news coverage.

Board President Steel said he supports forums like this. Wow! I must agree with him but my guess is that he was being disingenuous again.

Saw some statistics on the WTOL web site that were appalling. I wonder how many of these suspensions are for dress code violations. But I guess we won't know since I understand that TPS does not break this out of the "failure to follow directives" category.

Looked like the ABLE group did a good job of informing parents.

WTVG had a good spot on their news.

I also understand that TPS was supposed to distribute the flyers provided them by AAPA but never got around to it. Now why does that not surprise me. TPS always wants support but when asked to support parents and the community they always fall down!

Just my two cents.

knowing where your children are
Knowing who your children are with
Knowing the names of your children's teachers
Knowing what time school begins and ends

But most important of all: Knowing you are the parent and that you are responsible for your child's behavior both inside and outside your home

bill

***But most important of all: Knowing you are the parent and that you are responsible for your child's behavior both inside and outside your home***

Of course parents are responsible for their child but the school bears some responsibility because of the law , "in loco parentis" which is Latin for "in place of a parent." A person or institution that assumes parental rights and duties for a minor.

We aim to get everybody on the same page.

"Toledo's Public School Parents’ Association"

"Scott High School Chapter"

Looks more welcoming and you even save money on the 2 extra spaces saved in the title.

Delegate involved parents from each school to chose someone to lead each "chapter".

I could go on about being on the same page....

Of course parents are responsible for their child but the school bears some responsibility because of the law , "in loco parentis" which is Latin for "in place of a parent." A person or institution that assumes parental rights and duties for a minor.

We aim to get everybody on the same page.

Actually an accurate translation is, "In the place of a parent." Yes, it makes a difference, but you don't have to take my word for it. Go ask you attorney.

Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack

I would say that the 'same page' should be for the school to make it's rules known, for the students to FOLLOW the rules, and for the parents to respect the schools disciplinary actions & follow up at home with more of the same so it sinks in. They took the power away from the schools & even parents, so many parents buckle under the fear/threat that the kids will call the cops or report the parent for made up abuses & the kids know how much power they have with that. Kids have learned that if they can get their parents to fight the school's decision to discipline when the kids act up, they are home free. Meanwhile, kids are pulling crap (and getting away with it) above & beyond anything that would have happend 20 years ago. The worst school offenses when I was in school in the late 60's, were passing notes & chewing gum - and I got paddled hard with a big wooden paddle - three hard whacks with a skirt on, bent over the dean of girl's desk for passing a note in study hall (second offense). Needless to say, I didn't do it again.

My daughter (white) was a teacher's nightmare in high school - she became the devil reincarnate when she turned 13 yrs old (and turned back to her sweet self at 18). She'd gotten suspensions, in school suspensions, detentions - you name it. Not once did I go to school to argue her cause, because she broke the rules, she knew the rules before she broke them, and I respected the schools decision to dole out punishments. She also got punished at home for those same offenses. It just amazes me, that so many parents nowadays seem to believe that their little angel baby wouldn't DARE do anything wrong, and if the school says he/she did, then by gosh, the school must have their facts wrong. Schools deal with more discipline problems nowadays, than ever before - wonder why that is. Ya think maybe it's because the parents rush in to try to save their darlings & the kids know that mom & dad WILL rush in to try to save them? I think it sends a powerful message to the KIDS, to have meetings like this - the kids assume it's mom & dad looking for loopholes to save their sorry behinds - and I imagine, the respect these kids have for the teachers will erode even further. Parents need to stand united with the school/teachers in front of their kids. To do otherwise, sends the same type of message kids get when dad says "no', but we can get mom to say 'yes' & they sit back & watch the parents fight over it.

There is something disturbing about the name of this association. Can you imagine the outcry if there was a school meeting called by an organization named "The White American Parent's Association"? Or, "Asian"? I feel the same about the Negro College Fund - No way would it be accepted (or allowed) to have a "Caucasion College Fund". I hate descrimination of all kinds - even reverse discrimination. Titles of organizations & associations like that, only widen the racial divide in this country - where it is the Blacks that are saying "we are different & have a separate organization where whitey isn't allowed". It honestly doesn't help end racial strife.

It occurred to me, that if parents think there is a need for a forum to meet to discuss suspensions & expulsions - then it must also mean that there's a lot of suspensions & expulsions happening. Those things happen when kids break rules. If one of the main focus is to discuss "Know your rights, know how to advocate for your child" - that sounds like a bunch of parents angry that their kids got in trouble, and are looking for ways to either 1) show it's not their kids fault, or 2) find ways to get out of it. Kids have been breaking rules for thousands of years, and schools have had rules probably as long. The question is, why are so many more kids getting suspended & expelled than before? Hmm. Maybe because more kids are breaking the rules? This forum sounds like just a fancy way of saying "Enabler". Turn it around - insert 'drinking" or 'drug use" - would the parents be bending over backwards trying to prove the innocence of their kids? (Enabler) Or, would they let their kids learn some hard ass lesons in life by suffering the consequences of their actions?

Or, do you think it's a racial thing where your kids are being 'picked on' because of race? I thought Scott had a high percentage of black students, so that doesn't really make sense to me. If it was a predominately white school with only a handful of blacks, I could understand this concern more.

Not quite sure what you mean by ***Or, do you think it's a racial thing where your kids are being 'picked on' because of race? I thought Scott had a high percentage of black students, so that doesn't really make sense to me. If it was a predominately white school with only a handful of blacks, I could understand this concern more.***

Scott High School is home to 4 small schools. The students are 99% black because they are black why is it not believable that they would be suspended?

You also say.....***Titles of organizations & associations like that, only widen the racial divide in this country - where it is the Blacks that are saying "we are different & have a separate organization where whitey isn't allowed".***

I don't use the term "whitey" but all organizations such as the NAACP, United Negro College Fund, The African American Parents' Association and others have white membership. As a matter of fact the NAACP in Toledo has a large membership of white teachers. And more whites than blacks in membership. The NAACP was not founded by blacks. It was founded by a coalition of white and blacks, mainly whites. Know Black history before you make the kind of statements that you do. AAPA is accepting memberships and would be happy to have you as a member. The only condition is that you must be unashamedly for children.

That is what we are about.

purnhrt - Perhaps I wasn't clear. I meant, that this 'forum' - "African American Parent's Association" - who's purpose for this upcoming meeting, was to discuss expulsions & suspensions & how best to advocate for their kids if they do get suspendd or expelled - it sounds like a group of black parents who are taking issue with the fact that their kids are gettting suspensions & expulsions - it sounds like, because 'students' rights' are going to be discussed, and ways for parents to advocate for their kids - that the parents are in disagreement with these punishments. The only reason I mentioned the racial thing, was that I wondered if these parents were blaming the suspensions & expulsions on the fact that maybe their kids got singled out due to race, which made little sense to me because, as you said, Scott is mostly black students & not likely to single out black students to blame for misbehaviours as opposed to white students. Perhaps I misunderstood that part. It is completely believable to me that black students get in trouble - just as much as white, asian or hispanic students. I was just curious where the conflict is about these suspensions & expulsions - why the need for a forum/meeting to discuss student rights & advocacy?

The discussion of rights & advocacy suggests that some parents may believe their kids rights are being abused by these suspensions & expulsions. IF the parents did not believe their kids rights were being abused, then I doubt a forum/meeting to discuss their rights & ways to advocate for them would even be needed or discussed. Which leads me back to my original point - that kids who get suspended or expelled have broken rules or done something severe enough to warrent these punishments, and parents who give the appearance of finding loopholes or ways to 'protect' or 'save' their sweet perfect children are really enabling their kids bad behavior & are giving their kids a very strong message that the schools & teachers can be manipulated by the students - all they have to do is get mom & dad involved, complain they're being picked on. My point, was simply that if this is what it is (and it looks exactly like this is what it is), then those kids will have learned nothing, except the art of manipulation & whining "not fair" to get what they want - and they will keep breaking rules & getting suspensions & expulsions. Enabling, rather than standing in unity with the schools on disciplinary measures to create a strong front to the kids of what is right & wrong, accepted behaviour vs unaccepted behaviour. But perhaps I misunderstood the function of this forum/meeting................

If on the other hand, parents are concerned that suspensions & expulsions just translate into missed days at school (and more chances to get into trouble) - well, that's life. My daughter got plenty of in school detentions where she'd have to sit in a freaking booth practically for hours, doing homework. If they miss too many days in school where they don't pass - tough cookies. My daughter ended up getting her ged - it was her own damned fault. You can't force kids to care or learn. My two sons excelled in school - teachers loved them. But my daughter was a teacher's nightmare. And if she got in trouble & earned a punishment, she did the damned punishment - there was never a time when I rallied for her to be saved from that punishment. Not because I didn't love my daughter, but because I agreed that the school needs rules & that there are consequences if you break those rules - called tough love.

I am aware that whites belong to those organizations as well as blacks. But, are white kids also helped by the Negro College Fund? Doubtful. My point was simply that if there was a "White American Parents Association" - all hell would break out & blacks would scream "racists". Jesse Jackson would be all over it. IF there were a "White College Fund" - blacks would be furious. It'd be considered very politically incorrect to do that. I just think it's very hypocritical, and is reverse racism, and as long as associations are segregated then I don't see how the walls of racism will ever come down. And in this case - it is the blacks who are promoting racism.

I think it is laudable parents are getting involved with their children's school to see what they can do to make things better. I understand the concept of "in place of the parent" . My point was and is that the school should not be view as being there "instead of the parent" Too often the school becomes the parent having to feed them and provide care of them before and after school. It would be worth considering going back to an excellent program started under superintendent Frank Dick called the :Light House. Schools remained open in the evening to allow students to have access to computers and after school assistance with homework and parents too were given access to computers and parent classes. Most beneficial was the fact that parents and students embraced their local schools as an important resource in their neighborhood.

bill

***I just think it's very hypocritical, and is reverse racism, and as long as associations are segregated***

What part of my post didn't you read or understand? The Toledo chapter of the NAACP is made up of mostly white teachers, so it is not segregated! AAPA has white members and is not segregated!

United Negro College Fund is an organization that supports Historically Black Colleges and Universities. From their website- "A:UNCF was founded to address inequities in the educational opportunities afforded to African Americans. UNCF believes in higher education opportunities for all Americans. UNCF-member schools do not discriminate and UNCF-administered scholarships are open to all."

It is too bad that you don't know these things.

Exactly what is the definition of reverse racism. Because to me that is just something that white people use as a reflex term. The walls of racism will never come down because of the ignorant ramblings of people like you who don't read, don't know anything about black history or black people except what they see on TV or hear from their neighbor who is just like them. Stuck in the ways of "why can't it be like it was?"

People like you sit somewhere and stoke the fires of racism, never venturing out of your little box. Read a book, join a book club with people other than the ones who look like you, watch PBS and documentaries that talk about black people.

Here is something that I wrote to address an article in the Toledo Free Press after the “riot” in 2005 that I feel addresses all I would ever want to say to you. One of the columnists had written a very one sided view of the black community. When you have time please read and digest before making any off the wall comments:

tarred and feathered by his own demographics, inability to rise up from their impoverished muck, so many of them, loot, pillage stone and run amuck, "inner-city," the black community to get off the defensive and start taking care of itself, young black men.
1. Seven racist statements in such a small article and the sad thing is you probably do not see them as racist statements.
I really don't know where to begin or how to respond to your racist opinion that I read in the Free Press. It was so full of hate and venom, it was almost as if the Nazi's were here again. Toledo and most of America is a powder keg waiting for the right match. You suburbanites have no idea of the real problems facing American today. Racism is alive and well and although people like to say that we have come so far, we have not traveled far at all down the racial divide of the two Americas. One white, one black. Your opinion said it all. And the scary part is you that probably did not care who you hurt or offended by writing this venomous opinion. You probably did not think it was offensive.
I will begin by dispelling the seven racist statements:
1. tarred and feathered by his own demographics. While tarring and feathering took place in the 1700's the practice is seen as a prelude to lynching which is a distinctive phenomena carried out by white people on black people up until the beginning of the 21th century. The phrase "by his own demographics." I take it that you mean by other black people, when in actuality demographics means, according to the online Thesaurus- "Socioeconomic groups, characterized by age, income, sex, education, occupation, etc., that comprise a market niche." If you meant black people just say black people.

2. Inability to rise up from their impoverished muck.I doubt very seriously if Bill Cosby used words even close to "impoverished muck." I am a single, black, mother of six children who lives well below the poverty line. My children range in age from 34 down to 9 years old, with morals and values instilled in them by a loving and extended family. My thirty-four year old has a BA in Psychology from Knoxville College, has completed coursework in a Masters Program from Bowie State, attended Mercy's program for Nursing, is a Certified loctician and has her own business while raising three children along with her divorced husband. My eighteen year old (who was homeschooled), did well on her ACT's, is currently a freshman at Bowling Green, with scholarships. My family has never been on welfare, have never received foodstamps and while we do live below the line of poverty we are not impoverished. We are part of the black community but certainly we are not a part of the "muck" and neither are my neighbors, friends or anyone that I know. Incidently muck means "mud, filth, dung manure, something filthy or disgusting" Such hurtful words to describe a race of people, "especially it's men," who are our fathers, our brothers, our sons, our mates, our husbands. Oh, and by the way all of my children are adopted.
3."so many of them." them versus us, black versus white, gentile versus jew, old versus young, words of division. America the divided.................
4."loot, pillage stone and run amuck," when it is white kids on spring break it is "spring fever". How many towns or cities have been looted, pillaged and stoned during spring break, when rich white kids let loose just to have fun for two weeks?
5. "inner-city" Your statement that the " inner-city is full of pathologies that I, as a suburbanite can never begin to understand", is as about as racist as it can get. What makes you the queen of the mall because you are a "suburbanite?" If you are indicative of all suburbanites then I hope and pray all of my children stay in the inner-city and never try to pull themselves out of their "impoverished muck". I hope they stay as far away from the suburbs and its people as possible. As a matter of fact I would rather they come into contact with the neo Nazi's. They would be a hell of a lot safer.
6."the black community to get off of the defensive and start taking care of itself." Why don't you good white people give us the inner-city and let us take care of it. Of course that would mean your men and women can not clean our streets, pick up our trash, stop our fires, only the people who live in the inner city could perform these duties, you cannot teach our children, only if you live in the inner city, you can not police us, only if you live in the inner city, you can not bus us unless you live in the inner city, you cannot work in or own our stores, unless you live in the inner-city, you could not jail our children or represent them in court, unless you lived in the inner-city. You would not be able to work in any public agency that uses tax dollars, unless you lived in the inner-city. Then we could truly take care of our own community. Then we would be forced to get up off our "lazy, welfare gettin'', drug doin', baby makin' behinds" and take care of bizness.
7." young black men" we all know what those three words mean. Fathers gather your little white girls up. The animals have been let loose.
You are a destroyer of dreams because of your words. We (black people) are a people who despite not having a history, who were the strange fruit hanging from trees in full view, who watched our families being sold away, saw our mothers, wives, sisters and daughters being raped, saw our towns burned to the ground, still we have managed to survive our "hellacaust" and in that survival we still hug our children and wipe their noses, teach them to play doubledutch and hop scotch, hold each others hands, watch movies, eat popcorn, become mothers and father, bake bread and cookies, take care of our elders, pay homage to our ancestors, fish, take our children to soccer practice, braid each others hair, cry, laugh, read novels, talk on the telephone to our friends, tell each other secrets (promise not to tell), paint our nails, watch the sunset and the moon rise, celebrate birthdays, with cake and ice cream, Kwanzza with a Kinara, are afraid of the dark, love the sun, water our grass, shovel our snow, vote our conscience and pray to our God.
What more could a white female suburbanite ask for? What more can we can give?

I do wonder if a building permit was approved?

Why do you care? And then think about it. Do you really think this would be advertised if a permit had not been issued?

Of course, you probably see this as the "wrong type of activity" to which a public building should be used.

Would you feel the same, if the building was used for a levy activity? I assume you would believe it correct, a good use of taxpayer money, and would see every reason to bar the opposition from use of a public building for a rally, etc. regarding the levy.

"4."loot, pillage stone and run amuck," when it is white kids on spring break it is "spring fever". How many towns or cities have been looted, pillaged and stoned during spring break, when rich white kids let loose just to have fun for two weeks?"

Comparing kids (of any color) on spring break to a bunch of thugs (of any color) in a riot is like trying convince someone an apple really is an orange.

The people involved in that riot were just stupid, angry thugs. The nazi's never even left their staging area and even if they had what good did it do for the local community to burn a man out of his business?
Oh wait.. it's ok cause he was a white guy right?

If your post is representative of your community then you're destroying your own dreams by hiding behind your wall of blame.

purnhrt - many of the points you made are well taken, and I commend you on the success of your children - success achieved by your hand, I am sure. I do not claim to know all African-American history - however, contrary to what you may think, I do read a lot of books about that history, and have watched many documentaries, and some of my favorite movies that have helped educate me, have been those depicting black history ("The Color Purple", "Beloved", "A Raisin In The Sun", "To Kill A Mockingbird", "Miss Ever's Boys". I read Maya Angelo's "I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings" before I ever got to high school; and in the last few years, I have read "Slave Uprisings and Runaways: Fighting for Freedom and the Underground Railroad", "Coming Of Age In MIsssissippi", poetry by Langston Hughs, parts of "Narrative of Sojourner Truth" (a reading in progress), and plan to read "Roots", etc., etc.. This is by no means a complete listing - just off the top of my head. Contrary to your idea of my reading & viewing material, I have never in my life read a romance novel or watched a soap opera & other tv swill. My son is a history major, so I've been reading a lot of his text books. My other son is probably the most widely read person I know - all shakespeare, all the classic authors, Ayn Rand, Steinbeck, Fitzgerald, etc. I am currently reading "My Dearest Friend, Letters of Abigale and John Adams". Only so's you know I do read & have tried to educate myself.

Yes, I grew up with what you described "white eyes", and quite honestly, did not witness the horrors & racism here in Toledo, Ohio - the blacks & whites I went to school with seemed to get along pretty well. I never heard any of them use the "N" word that gets tossed out so easily by blacks - it was the 'ugly' word, that you just did not say. Having said that, as I grew older, I learned - and with that learning, my eyes opened - that there was an entire history I was unaware of. Now, I realize, that much of the ugliest of racism was farther south (we didn't travel). My initial knee-jerk reaction to angry blacks years ago, was that they were too young to have been slaves, as were their parents - that nobody had ever owned or sold them. Now, I can understand how probably all blacks had family members who were affected, mistreated, killed. I learned that even in the 60's this violence was still occurring - lynchings, rapes, the KKK - the 60's, when I had assumed slavery had ended & been put to rest. I naively believed, that the rest of the country was living peacefully together like they were doing in my high school here in Toledo, Ohio. And I began to educate myself. I admit, I have much to learn - but I have made a serious attempt.

My statement about 'reverse racism' - I just meant that to mean where whites who scored higher & are more qualified get passed over for promotions or jobs because there are black 'quota's to meet. Where a lesser qualified black will get the job because to give it to a more qualified white person will bring out cries of racism. I do NOT mean that to say, that blacks in general are less skilled or qualified (I assume you will make that leap) - but I have seen it happen quite a bit. My dad lost out on several Toledo Firemen promotions to black firemen who scored far lower on the tests - one who got the promotion couldn't even spell the word 'coat' correctly. I think the term 'reverse racism' is accurate - it is doing to the white man what had been done to the black man. If it was racism one time, then it is still racism this time.

The black organizations - yes, they have white members. But I am still waiting on the answer, "Does the Negro College Fund also benefit the white students?" And, would the blacks not be outraged by a similar organization called "The White American Parent's Association"? I am just asking if it would not be better to just call it the "American Parent's Association" - one that leaves no race out. Because I can guarantee you, if you stick the word "Black" in that title, white parents will assume they are not invited. Thus, creation of a segregation of race, by blacks. I am just asking how racism can ever end, as long as walls like that are still being erected.

Inner City - I never made the assumption that only blacks lived in the inner cities, because they don't. My brother lives in the inner city, as does my ex-sister in law, as does my nephew - all white. The inner city is a blend of all races - not just blacks, so I don't understand why you'd take offense to the wording 'inner city' & call it a racist comment. "In the muck" of the inner city - again, I fail to see why that phrase would fire up a statement of racism by you. Lots of races live in the inner city, and the inner cities more often than not, could use cleaning up, fixing, rebuilding. I personally know of an hispanic woman (and kids) who have lived in the inner city her entire life - on welfare - just as her mother & grandmother did (and kids) - an unbroken chain of women with kids on welfare in the inner city who have let their homes go to hell, partly because they have no money, partly because they are rentals that rely on an unhelpful landlord, but mainly with this woman (and her extended family) it is lazy & I don't give a damn & drunk that accounts for her lack of motivation to clean up her part of the 'muck of the inner city & rise above it & take care of her own". Hispanic, not black. Quite honestly, my alcoholic brother isn't much better, and he is white.

Young Black men - When I hear the words "black men" I do not leap to the conclusion of 'hide your daughters', or think criminal or rapist, etc. Ever. I don't think anything by the words alone. If I am walking alone down a secluded street after dark (rarely) - and I saw a small group of young men on the corner, it would not be the color of their skin that would make me nervous. It would be how they dressed, behaved, language, attittude that would make me nervous or not. If they are dressed in prison gangsta falling down pants & lots of jewelry, & talking rough & street talk - yes, I may be nervous. But I see a lot of white guys dressing & acting this way & I'd be nervous regardless of what color their skin was. If however, guys are having 'trust' issues, maybe they ought to look in the mirror & listen to what they sound like & ask themselves why they are promoting themselves in a derogatory, threatening, rough way. If they want to be viewed & treated with trust & respect, then they should present themselves that way. Of any color.

"by his own demographics." - I'm not sure what the statistics are, of what races kill each other off the most. But there does seem to be more blacks killing blacks, than whites killing blacks (at least nowadays)I don't know who kills each other more - blacks killing whites or whites killing whites - that could be a toss up because there's an awful lot of crazy ass white people out there killing, abusing, raping & robbing. It wouldn't surprise me if there were more whites killing whites. I say that because I think you made a bit of a leap to call that demographic statement 'racist'. Just as I think it was a bit of a leap to connect the tar & feathers to lynching. But yes, the connection eventually can be made. I also don't know the statistics of what race does more drugs, commits more rapes & crimes. I realize the prisons have a large black population - I am not sure if they are there because they got blamed for crimes they didn't do because they are black, or because they commit more crimes in general. Perhaps you can post statistics here if you know them.

All this said - Perhaps what I should have initially asked you about this forum/meeting at Scott, is this. What is it about the expulsions & suspensions at Scott that are so bad, that the parents feel the need to even have this forum/meeting to discuss rights & advocacy? Do the parents feel that punishments are being given unfairly? You briefly mentioned the purpose of the meeting in your post, but could you expand on it? Has something happened or happening that is cause for concern where kids rights are being violated? Maybe the answer to that will go a long way here & help people realize it isn't just a racial issue - where many posters here wonder if because that association title has "Black Parents" in it, it must be a racial thing where blacks think they are being treated unfairly. If indeed, there are wrongdoings going on at Scott, it'd be helpful if you made that known..

Know Black history before you make the kind of statements that you do.

That's a racist comment. If I wrote anything similar, such as "Why don't you try reading real history?" or, perhaps, "If you'd care to look at white Angelo-Saxon protestant history" you'd be all over me like white on rice. You write it, and somehow your racially biased comment should be acceptable to everyone. The African American Parents’ Association suffers the same problem, unless you're trying to exclude non-African Americans, that is. Are you?

I doubt that any of these meetings will change anything. Teachers will continue to suspend and expel students at their own whim. Students will never learn any self-discipline or emotional maturity. Those that do learn will be rare individuals who will likely continue their education into college and away from Toledo.

It's unlikely that corporal punishment will be reinstated. Unfortunately, until it is, the few instructors who really want to teach and see their students improve have no real recourse but to dismiss the behavior challenge du jour and continue along with a shrinking student population.

Mad Jack
Mad Jack's Shack

You said:

***But I am still waiting on the answer, "Does the Negro College Fund also benefit the white students?"***

Did you not see this? ***From their website- "A:UNCF was founded to address inequities in the educational opportunities afforded to African Americans. UNCF believes in higher education opportunities for all Americans. UNCF-member schools do not discriminate and UNCF-administered scholarships are open to all."***

I am sure that you are very well read or else you would not be able to write the way that you do on varying subjects, however, these movies and books ***("The Color Purple", "Beloved", "A Raisin In The Sun", "To Kill A Mockingbird", "Miss Ever's Boys". I read Maya Angelo's "I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings" before I ever got to high school; and in the last few years, I have read "Slave Uprisings and Runaways: Fighting for Freedom and the Underground Railroad", "Coming Of Age In MIsssissippi", poetry by Langston Hughs, parts of "Narrative of Sojourner Truth" (a reading in progress), and plan to read "Roots", etc.,*** are not indicative nor exclusive of the black experience. While it is a start and may be a very good start for you there are many other authors,(white and black) historians, plays, playwrights and poets that disclose the black America that white America ignores. Which is why white America was taken aback about the words that Rev. Jeremiah Wright used in his church.

You and others have called me a racist on many occasions because I see things through “black eyes” and you see things through “white eyes.” For instance I can not comprehend where the term reverse racism comes into play. But you have explained what you mean when you use that term. Let me explain why to me this term is ludicrous.

I was hired on a good paying job in 1974 during the height of the “equal opportunity” movement. I was hired because the company was looking for a black woman. I had to be twice as good as the white women who were hired before me. They were given the benefit of the doubt because they were white, had little education but at that time this company began hiring women so any white woman would do. White women were hired first and then black women. I was overqualified for the job but I took it because it was part time and it was good money and I needed a job. Was that reverse racism because a man was not hired for the job although 400 men were working at this particular company (no women of any color) at the time me and the three white women were hired? I don't think so but i am sure that you do. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

The Forum is not just for Scott parents it is being held at Scott High School. With 96,000 days out of school for TPS last school year, I would think that this is a community problem.

The issues at Scott High school are well known and have been discussed on this site and Toledo Talk.

Purnhrt and I have had times where we haven't seen eye to eye on topics involving race, but truthfully I don't really see anything racist about this event.

Yes, it happens to be co-sponsored by the African American Parents' Association. But the invitation is open to parents, guardians, grandparents, and the general public. I'm sure there are white and Hispanic families (or any other race/nationality) who might benefit from the topic, and I can't imagine they would be turned away at the door for not being black.

And one of the 4 segments is "know the rules," so it sounds like the group is trying to educate parents on what kind of behavior can get their kids in trouble in the first place. Not just help parents try to get kids out of trouble after the fact.

There is no doubt that your experiences shape your life. Where you come from, how you were treated, what triumphs and failures you experienced….shapes our lives and how we see events. Look at your life and ask yourself, how your experiences shaped you and understand how that background may make it difficult to fully comprehend and experience the other side of the debate.

Many of the comments made seem to make the assumption that the rules are fair and enforced in a fair manner. Frankly, many of the causes for suspension at TPS are arbitrary and depend upon each authority figure’s view of the rules. The two “rules” broken most at TPS that result in suspension are failure to follow directives and disorderly conduct. Both of these “rules” are at the discretion of the teacher or authority figure observing the behavior. These offenses are not violent. Suspension can occur for any minor offense such as throwing your wadded up paper from a distance into a waste basket. I kid you not, this one actually happened and the kid was suspended for disorderly conduct.

Principals and hearing officers are reluctant to rule against the teacher. There is a camaraderie that puts the adults first and the benefit of the child second. Also, a principal that does not “back up” his teachers is “tagged” by teachers and the building committee and since principals do not really have much authority at TPS there is little they can do if teachers in the building decide to undermine the principal’s efforts. In addition, word quickly gets around and since teachers sit on the interview/selection team for determining the building principal (at least they used to as I participated in two such hiring teams), most prospective candidates don’t want that type of “word” going out. I believe that most principals and teachers have the best interests of students at heart and try to be fair, but a broken system can have an impact. The current discipline system allows for abuses as it does not collect data and provide for periodic review. A teacher who just may be prejudiced toward males or those of color, etc. is not identified through periodic review since data is not collected and analyzed. Unless parents begin to complain and someone sees a pattern and actually acts, TPS has no way to identify and correct the abuses if it wanted to.

What makes matters worse is that students, in most cases, are not allowed to make up the work missed. Teachers through contract language determine whether a student gets to make up the work. Depending upon the length and timing of a suspension, this could result in failure. I could go into a lengthy discussion about suspensions and drop out rates, how such a situation could lead to more discipline issues by the student… but I’ll refrain for now.

The purpose of disciplining children is to modify behavior not set a child on the road to failure. A suspension is supposed to be the means to modify the behavior (we can debate the efficacy of this punishment). In essence I see the inability to make up work and its impact on student success as double whammy. Some may want to debate this point, but I think it is in our best interests to assure a student graduates, stays off welfare and out of prison!

Then we get to due process. A notice to suspend is sent to parents. In most cases the suspension is to begin immediately. If parents decide to appeal a decision (and suspensions are overturned, albeit not often as most parents just assume the authority figure must be right) in most cases the suspension has been served. If rules are not fairly enforced, students are not given due process, steps are not taken to modify behavior, then it erodes the effectiveness of the discipline system and student behavior deteriorates and suspensions accelerate.

There is more to this story that would take volumes to explain, but I do believe the current process at TPS lacks effectiveness, common sense, age appropriate discipline, measured response, uniform implementation, preventive action, adequate intervention….and needs to be completely audited and modified.

So to those that say just follow the rules, there is always, with regard to TPS, more to the story.

This forum as I understand it gives parents the tools to understand what rules are in place, the discipline process, the rights of parents and students and is aimed at helping parents be more effective parents and advocates for their children. Most on this blog emphasize the importance of parents. Here is an example of empowering parents to be part of the discipline process and assure that discipline is about modifying behavior and not just the blind practice of “zero tolerance”.

Just how could it hurt?

Steve says: This forum as I understand it gives parents the tools to understand what rules are in place, the discipline process, the rights of parents and students and is aimed at helping parents be more effective parents and advocates for their children. Most on this blog emphasize the importance of parents. Here is an example of empowering parents to be part of the discipline process and assure that discipline is about modifying behavior and not just the blind practice of “zero tolerance”.

I do agree with this and learning to advocate for you and your child. Most importantly, I hope parents learn being involved in their child's lives is the strongest tool that is effective!

Well Sandy it does appear we have found some common ground. Now let us keep looking for other areas. While we do so, let us keep an open and critical mind.

Look behind the curtain and you may find more than you seek.

Thanks for the input sflagg, it was helpful. Purnhrt could easily have explained the same early on, but instead copped a major attitude. My main issue, was the wording of the organization. At a time when we are supposed to be working towards breaking down racial walls, it seems counterproductive to create parent associations for public schools that are clearly racial in nature. Just remove the word "black' from the title - simply make it "American Parent's Association" & it wouldn't have raised any red flags. Because, I can guarantee you, that if a TPS parent group formed an association called the "White American Parent's Association", all hell would have broken loose. The wording creates walls where there shouldn't be walls. I do admit I am out of the school loop a bit - these problems didn't seem to occur when I or my kids were in school, not to this degree at least. Yes, there were suspension & expulsions at Whitmer where my kids went, and yes, my daughter got a few - but there was never a time when I assumed the school handed the punishments out unfairly. My daughter broke the rules, she knew she did.

Off hand, I would say any infraction that is violent in nature to be non negotiable in it's handling. Back talk & swearing - the same. Skipping school, constant tardiness - the same. Whitmer had an in school suspension where the students sat for hours in tiny walled booths & had to work on school work - no talking or other reading allowed. They got the work done, kept up in school - but hated those detentions & suspensions with a passion. It can be very boring to sit for four hours.

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