Trash is an ever present part of life. We are a consumer driven economy and we generate more trash than can be described in any form. The problem on our streets, in our parks and in the city overall are not a result of city nelgect..the trash comes from us, the sloppy, uncaring public.

People throw trash out of their car windows, fail to secure garbage from animal and youth disruption and worst of all, rather than pick it up, we call and bitch someone else out about it. Sheer laziness is the root of this problem. It's always "Someone else's" fault.

While pushing the city to do a better job of clean up, we also need to do our part. STOP throwing garbage out car windows, stop leaving bags in unprotected areas and for crying out loud, buy some lidded garbage cans..they are cheap and effective.

In my area, I walk around daily and pick up junk and trash from the streets and sidewalks around my home. If everyone did this and made a regular practice of it, things would clean up quickly. Go ahead and call city hall, write emails and by all means complain, but don't do it from an armchair. You are either the problem or the solution, there is no sideline. Just becasue you didn't put it there doesn't mean you cannot help pick it up. At least by helping pick up you are contributing to the solution rather than the problem.

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This is actually what I've always hated the most about smokers. Not their second hand smoke. Not the smell of their habit that they leave on my clothes. Not the health problems that I pay for with my higher premiums and my tax dollars.

No.. what I've always hated the most was the throwing of the butts out the window. Rare is a smoker that doesn't do it at least some of the time. It's like they don't even consider it littering. It's a reflex, trained from the flick of thousands and thousands of butts that are now somebody else's problem.

I'd support the smoking ban as nothing else but punishment for 75 years of habitual littering.

I'm sure Brian is right on my heals, as all good stalkers should be, so I look forward to whatever insipid drivel he decides to proffer.

Anyone interested in the future of Trash disposal should read up on Plasma Gasification.

The gist is simple:

A machine creates a plasma reaction that's so hot that it dissolves the molecular bonds of our trash and breaks it down to its constituent elements. It's only byproducts are a obsidian-like glassy substance and a composite gas dubbed SynGas that's mostly Nitrogen and Hydrogen and is captured and sold.

An electrical charge is used to start the machine but afterwards the super-heated syngas is used to produce enough electricity to run the machine and still sell some back to the power grid.

In other words, it's pretty f'in remarkable. They're not cheap to build, but there's no doubt in my mind of the promise of the technology. One is currently being built on Long Island.

I had an incident happen to me today that I will deal with, but it hasn

Old South End Broadway

I know a fellow much older than I (he is in his 80

Old South End Broadway

A couple of weeks ago I encountered a Recycling collector screaming at the top of his lungs in front of my house about how much he hates his "fucking job," and "the fucking collection bins." He hurled one of those "fucking collection bins" at my neighbor's house. I called the Department and hopefully the little twerp was taken care of. Maybe he was disgruntled because of the sucess of the recycling program and the fact that he now has more work to do.

You know what gets me is that there are are seven types of plastic recyclables. Toledo only accepts two (PET and HDPE). One of the most common, polystyrene (PS) isn't even considered, and yet every time we buy electronics we end up with light weight, but big and bulky plastic "spacers" that I must throw away because the city doesn't accept them as "recyclable". I worked in a plastic molding factory in my youth, and this stuff could easily be recycled (probably even here in Toledo). Instead, into the black plastic bag, and then into the land-fill.

Old South End Broadway

One reason I think smokers toss cigs out of car windows is that few cars come equipped with ashtrays anymore. I bought ashtrays for our cars first thing - & in a pinch, would use a pop can. I don't toss cigs out a car window because I worry it'll fly back into somebody else's car (or back into MY car while I'm driving - I've seen this happen). I'll stick a butt in my pocket at times, and blast my daughter's friends if they drop butts in my driveway. I would suspect that cig butts are bio-degradable because I've seen them slowly disintigrate & vanish over time. But they are ugly to look at, I admit. The worst to me is to see a huge pile of butts from somebody who's dumped out the car ashtray on the ground. (I try to not sweat the small stuff - I know that in time, theu'll degrade & be gone.) And it will get worse with the smoking ban because they say go outside to smoke, but are required with this law to have removed all ashtrays & anything that could double for an ashtray. So when people abide by the smoking ban laws & step outside to smoke & there's no ashtrays or containers - well, it's just short sighted on the part of the law passers. I also think cig butt littering is the worst possible reason to have voted for a smoking ban. Better to tighten up & enforce the littering laws, just like they need to enforce the drinking & drivng laws with some seriousness. But to vote for a ban that strips the rights of private business owners (it IS their property that THEY have to clean up after all) & will hurt or destroy small businesses just because you're annoyed at litterbugs outside......I'm at a loss for words to that.

On a similar litter note - what happens to all the balloons that people release? The Blade just pictured some event (or something) where a lot of balloons were released. Happens a LOT, weddings, parties, major events, etc. Balloons are NOT bio-degradable, no more than disposable diapers are. I don't know if it's a problem for wildlife & birds as far as swallowing deflated balloons tied with strings (or fish). A big deal is made about cig butts tossed on the ground, but nobody seems to care about balloons. I see this all the time - balloons on strings caught in electrical wires, trees, floating in ponds & rivers, etc. Also those plastic pop & beer can holders with the holes - birds get them caught around their necks. My personal gripe are empty bottles tossed & broken.

Does every post on the forum have to be turned into a smoking/no smoking debate?

I'm sure there is more cig butt litter than deflated balloons (on strings) - but there's a LOT of balloons set aloft - sometimes hundreds at a time, weddings, special events, etc. .............and where do they go?

6 Months ago I woke up at 3:00am thinking that sone day that Swamp Bubblles will start debating Cig Butts vs. Balloon disposal.

Fortunately, I got lucky and my Spouse gave me a surprise and took care of me.

We have to keep a sense of humor about it brassmonkey - you're right, bickering over this is absurd. But I'm going to bury a few butts & mark it on my calendar & see how long they take to decompose. My point was not protesting balloons - it was to point out that there's a LOT of littering besides cig butts. And if you use that arguement to create bans, then you better be prepared to ban all canned or bottled beverages, candy wrappers, etc. You may not smoke or consume canned or bottled beverages or eat candy in wrappers less than six feet of strippers who release balloons into the air? This ban shit is turning into a circus of absurdity.

Here is a link to Lucas County information.

I didn

Old South End Broadway

Went to the "Clean Wood" composting center at 5330 Stickney Avenue. You have to dispose of your yard waste (in my case long grass clippings) in a large pile they have about 75 yards from the headquarters (a mobile home/office).

They are open until 7:00 PM, and they let me do my thing even though I came to their gate at 6:55 PM. I also removed grass from plastic bags, and so put about 6-8 bags worth of clippings in the pile. You can't just throw plastic bags of clippings on the pile.

They also have a site at 6505 Bancroft (just west of an overpass) that seems newer, and is also open until 7:00 PM. Check the Oregon website for information about getting rid of limbs, grass clippings, and other yard "waste". The center at 6505 Bancroft also has what appears to be a small business for selling the compost that comes from the wood, and grass clippings.

Old South End Broadway


...even thought I don't support such things as smoking bans, I could not agree with you more when it comes to smokers who just flick their butts wherever they happen to be.

I know not all smokers are so inconsiderate - but it seems like the vast majority of them are!!!

But won't Waste to Energy create Global Warming. How many Carbon Credits will this thing costs? Watch out - Gore will get you!

Side note, I remember visiting my little bro years ago in MI during a dry summer. I noticed a lot of large strips of charred grass in the mediums and shoulders of some of the highways and major roads we were on.

I told him MI grass looks pretty Evil. He told me it was from smokers throwing lit butts out the window and lighting up the dried grass. Litter on a whole new Level.

My favorite Smokers are the ones that work at Gas Stations. I enjoy the irony when they step outside to smoke.


This is actually what I've always hated the most about smokers. Not their second hand smoke. Not the smell of their habit that they leave on my clothes. Not the health problems that I pay for with my higher premiums and my tax dollars.

But, of course, you managed to get those other things squeezed in, gidn't you, you little troll?


Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?


'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

I asked the recycling manager for Toledo the same question about more plastics recycling and the status is at this time there are plans for more capturing.

I know that there are companies that will and do accept the other plastics but with the recycling program finally getting off the ground it will take some time to expand into other types.

You're comparing the releasing of balloons to the littering of cigarette butts? Seriously?

How about this...

How about when people releasing 5, 10 balloons a day, every day, for years, then we'll compare them, OK?

Besides, I didn't say I voted for the smoking ban because of littering. I didn't even say that I voted for the smoking ban.

I say this mostly in jest, but I can't count more then 5 people who I know who smoke. We have around 100 people in my office; only 3 smoke.
None of my immediate friends smoke (I really do have friends).

I don't begrudge you (I smoke the occasional cigar), but it just stuck me that is seams strange to have someone say they smoke.

where they banned plastic bags? They're one of my most hated items from my 'ditchpig' days-I used to live next to an abandoned railroad track and wooded area, and took it upon myself to try to keep it clean now and then. Plastic bags were by far the most common items, followed by pop cups and paper bags and styrofoam containers from fast-food places. Go out to the McDonalds way out the trail close to Waterville, and take a look at the garbage blowing around, and you'll know why the ones who live around there fought so hard to keep it out. The thing that really pissed them off was, a well-off local judge owned the property and sold it to the company)at least the way I heard it). The funny thing is, we were more or less forced to go to plastic bags years ago by people who wanted to save the trees. Now the same ones are demanding we go back to paper bags.


Why should one more drop of our soldiers blood be spilled on foreign soil? Why fight/die for 'freedom' anymore when our citizens are pissing it away at the voting booth?


'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

There is a lot of littering besides cig butts.

But I've never seen more habitual litterers than cigarette smokers. You know, people here who label me and think they have me all figured out would be surprised to know that for about 2 years when I was 17-19, I smoked about a pack a day (Marl lights in a box). I've always been conscientious about littering, recycling, conservation, etc, but I was as guilty as the next guy about dropping my butts wherever I pleased.

I quit for a number of reasons, and have no problem with smokers exercising their right to breath their "dirty air." I do wish smokers respected my right not to breath their dirty air, but we've went 9 rounds on that subject and everyone here should know by now that nobody is going to be convinced one way or the other.

Anyway, to suggest that candy-wrapper littering or balloon-releasing happens with ANYWHERE NEAR the propensity of cigarette butt littering is disingenuous to say the least. I mean, a smoker is going thru, say, 20 cigs a day, every day. Many, I'm sure, are disposed of properly, but MANY are not and if you're going to try to dispute that then you're clearly just trying to 'cover' for a class of people who you feel are already demonized enough.

Either way, cig butts, as I said, are plastic. They certainly are not very biodegradable. The paper on the outside of the butts will decompose, but not the filter itself. At least not very quickly. You can try your "bury and wait" experiment but it's not an organic compound. It's gonna take a while.

As much as I enjoy you, Shane, I, as a responsible smoker, and you can ask my wife who does the laundry, and as a maintenance person who gets paid to pick up butts, flick the cherries off the stick, snap off and discard the biodegradable tobacco and put the butt in my pocket.


Hardly spend enough time in a car to warrant a cigarette, but when the occassion arises, there is an empty Pepsi can I slide my waste into.

Rare? Responsible.

..a happy ending?

Actually, as I understand it, it won't.

The wonderful thing about this is that nothing is emitted into the atmosphere. The SynGas is valuable and therefore captured and sold. The "obsidian like glass" can be disposed of just about anywhere as it seems to be entirely non hazardous. Maybe they can grind it up and use it someplace else, I'm not sure, but worst case scenario they dump it into the ocean or in a ditch someplace.

And the actual SynGas->Energy is just running the SynGas thru some turbines as it cools down.

This was on the cover of Popular Science in March or April and it blew my mind.

but I'm getting sick and f**king tired of hearing rabid smoker-haters parrot the same goddamned liwes over and over. I've cut and pasted this from the TT board.


Which One of these statements is one of the biggest lies ever told.

1)."The tobacco companies were sued by the states to recoup the money spent on medicare and medicaid smoking-related illnesses."

2). "We raised taxes on tobacco in the state (Taft said this in oHEILo, but take your pick of states-all said the same thing) in order to pay for medicare/medicaid smoking related illnesses."

3). "We're the government, we have your best interests at heart, and we're here to help."

4). All of the above.


I'm sick and tired of hearing that horseshit that the nazis parrot about everyone having to pay for any smoker's problems-they pay more taxes than any other group of people in the country. And that's what the money was SUPPOSED to be used for. Fatasses and alcoholics cost the country a hell of a lot more-many times over. And they don't pay their share of those exorbitant taxes, which is why.
posted by Darkseid at 11:21 P.M. EST on Mon May 21, 2007 #

The tobacco settlement was the largest transference of wealth in US history. Where did that money go? And that


'I used to have compassion, but they taxed it and legislated it out of existence.'

I'm a troll because you're a rabid nicotine addict whose addiction prevents you from seeing clearly?

OK.... Whatever you say...

I suppose the upside, Dark, is that you're an old man, right? ... Your trouble with "oHEILo" is in its waning years, wouldn't you say? ...That's something to look forward to, for all of us I think.

...starling makes a good point - the butts do seem to be biodegrable (not being a smoker or having scientifically tested this, I'm not positive), but balloons are not - so in terms of the overall impact to the environment and the issue of trash, balloons are more of a problem - even though the butts are uglier...

Cigarette butts are made of cellulose acetate, a form of plastic. It's probably more biodegradable than latex, but it's far from an organic compound that gets reabsorbed into the soil in a matter of days or, at worst, weeks.

I couldn't find a hard number on the amount of time outside it would take to be reabsorbed, but it's not quite as harmless as they seem at first blush.

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