John Foley new TPS superintendent?

John Foley Interim Superintendent has a contract which should be voted on at a special board meeting some time this week before Friday. The contract is now being looked over by each side's attorney. Was that quick or what?

I saw this on the news tonight. Later I happened to see Darlene Fisher at a library and she knew nothing about it. When I told her it was the first she had heard about it.

Once again secrecy and once again Darlene Fisher was not invited to the party.

No votes yet

it isn't too tough to come up with a contract when he can basically only get what Sanders got, per the 'me too' language agreement. As for Fisher knowing nothing about it, she seems to play the 'uninformed' act quite well. She is just as much at fault as the rest of the board for botching the Harner hiring, and she gets no pass from me.

Tpsteacher - Ms. Fisher worked hard to get Harner once she realized what was going on. You are obviously aware that she got beat on pretty badly about not going along to get along. She gets blame for bowing to that pressure and trying to work with certain board members when she knew they did not want to work with her. But I think it is human nature to back off when people beat on you. Then you find out that even though they voted with you they were really working against you.

I hope she tells her whole story soon as I know she looked at many ways to overcome the obstacles. I'm going to encourage her to share her story. I think we all should.

Ask Anita Lopez and Terry Glazer former school board members. They have told me and others of times where they were purposely excluded from knowledge until it was too late to do anything about it. (And sometime in the very near future I have an interesting story about a very big issue that board members did not know about until after the fact - another day and another story.)

There are games being played out there that goes to control of the economic engine called TPS. This is about controlling the money and who gets it. The financial leverage that TPS has, even in a budget crisis, is enormous and some have learned that lesson well. Some such as myself have been targets because we ask some hard questions and won't back off.

I was recently the subject of a personal attack on this very site. Buried in the some nasty language and insinuations, were a couple of points that were valid. I would have liked to answer those questions but I can't validate that kind of behavior by debating the points. We all need to condemn this behavior regardless of who is attacked in this manner. And that includes calling me out if others think I have crossed the line.

Given that backdrop, I think we can all see how easy it is to try to go along to get along.

I don't believe Fisher is playing any game. I believe her when she says she didn't know about it.

for believing the party line. You only know what you know. Till the day that you really find out what happened.

I also, having been close to this process, would be very grateful if Mrs. Fisher would tell the whole story. Of course the people who have been so tough on her would really have a reason to be vindictive if she were to expose them.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

We all were. The President of the school board named the negotiating 'team' of Torres and Sykes. Sykes, of course, took the lead position.

Mrs. Fisher, if you read the email file, asked about what was going on. She was never answered. She asked Ms. Barnett if there could be weekly updates out of the negotiating team. Mrs. Barnett said no.

You can't be informed under these circumstance. I sent an email myself asking for an update and was told it would be inappropriate to give me that information.

We all TRIED to find out what was going on, and nobody tried harder than Mrs. Fisher.

Under those circumstances, I think these statements are unfair.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

Fisher has admitted that while she asked for updates, she was passive in the first weeks. The call (referred to in the email) and email on March 27 from the search firm was, I believe, her first indications of a problem.

If she had went public at that point, maybe something would have happened. Nonetheless, the other board members would have beat upon her as they have every time she has went public. Put yourself in her shoes.

I'm going to come to the defense of tpsteacher24. I've read the other posts and while I sometimes have disagreements, this individual has been thoughtful and in agreement or understood much of what we have discussed. I was disappointed that you let GZ get under your skin, but I do know how tough it is to restrain yourself when you feel a criticism is unjustified.

GZ - I think you got a bit carried away. I do understand your general feelings on this issue as I share many of them with you.

TPSteacher has put out very thoughtful posts and I agree with that point. GZ's frustration is something we are all suffering from.

I've only just recognized it when I was out canvassing with a candidate recently. Two of the doors we knocked on were TPS employees and they were hungry for information. The information they did have was factually incorrect, I even heard one of our councilwomen on the radio last week, once again reiterating one of the false stories that Larry Sykes gave out. That the Harners' were wanting to send their daughter to Maumee Valley Day School and the taxpayers pay the tuition.

They never even talked to that school. So - even the district employees didn't get information and when they did - it was bad information.

I suggest we direct our frustration where it rightfully belongs and that would be at the school board president, who named someone to negotiate with Bill Harner when it was not secret to anyone that this was not that board members desire - to hire him.

And secondly to the board member, Larry Sykes who failed to negotiate with Bill Harner for six weeks. And then miraculously can put a contract together for HIS choice in a couple of days.

The whole things' rotten

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

I don't want to come to the defense of Darlene Fisher because I have been accused by the media of being a "mouthpiece for a friend."

No one is asking you for a pass but if you haven't been to a board meeting and seen the antics of "Three for Children" I am sure that if you had attended the board meetings EVEN you would change your mind.

If you know anything about domestic violence and the abuse of women by bullying men you would see that Darlene Fisher is a product of the environment of abuse on the school board. She has been mentally abused by Steel, Barnett and Sykes. Torres and Messina who was a witness to the abuse did not stand up and "try" to stop it. Therefore Ms. Fisher was alone, even though this was all done in a public venue.

Ms. Fisher won the election on a platform of real community engagement, fiscal accountability and improved academic opportunities for all students. She has not deviated from that commitment.

Here is the scenario(and I was there for all of it) November 2005, Darlene Fisher wins a seat on the Board of Education for TPS. December 8, 2005 Sanders resigns to take effect six months later. January 5, 2006 Darlene Fisher elected president of Board. January 10, 2006 Board has a retreat. At the retreat Sykes jumps immediately on Fisher and Torres with the words you "you campaigned for change, just what kind of change are you talking about?" Without giving either a chance to respond he began a campaign of separation and dysfunction and saying that Sanders did not want to stay at TPS because of Darlene Fisher. All of this occurred even before the first board meeting January 31, 2006. Ms. Fisher was never able to even begin to implement any of her action plans because of the dissension caused by the abuser.

Sort of like when you get married and the man that you marry is not who he says he is. You have pure motives, and everyone is

If this is, in fact, true, then I have two things to say:

1. We could do far worse than John Foley. Could we do better? Yes, I mean, we could always do better. We could've done better than Harner, too. But we certainly could do worse.

2. Once the ink dries on this thing, I hope that all of you championing change in TPS don't treat this like you to the smoking ban, where your inability to accept The Way Things Are prevents you from getting inside the machine and trying to effect change.

I think the district needs activists. It also needs qualified candidates to run for school board. I personally feel that TPS is positioned well for a large urban district, and not for nothing but the statistics agree with me here. Still, anybody watching the Harner fiasco can see that our Board leaves much to be desired.

I don't know why you all are giving Teacher24 a pass.

Another tactic of an abuser is to get the victim away from family and friends, hence the many many executive sessions since Ms. Fisher got on the board. I have no idea what takes place in the executive sessions but I would bet my first born that it is a gang bang on Darlene. I used to see Anita Lopez coming out of the executive sessions literally in tears.

In the 12 years I have been attending school board meetings I have never seen so many school board meetings, special board meetings and such that have taken place since Fisher got on the board. In the month of January 2006 there was one January 4th, 10th, 26th and the regular meeting on the 31st. These meetings were not to get school business taken care of but were used to demoralize victimize and harass Ms. Fisher. If I am wrong show me another time when the TPS BOE held so many board meetings in one month.

And definately not that many executive sessions that took place. Darlene Fisher never had a chance to gain her footing after being made president. What other group of responsible people do you know of who would vote a newcomer as president of a board that was looking for a new superintendent?

All of this was a plan and anyone who can't see it doesn't want to see it like the reporter at the Blade!

It has certainly turned nasty hear on the site. The only way it would get nastier is if our esteemed Board members posted here.

I guess I'll express my opinion (this is what this place is about, right). The Board majority got who they wanted, but it seems to be under quite auspicious circumstances.

While it is an unpopular sentiment, I believe all the Board members should go. Wipe 'em all out. If Fisher so ineffectual in getting change she has to go also. People make the same argument when teachers can't get students to pass the state tests, no excuses right. (Also isn't it interesting that the Torres-Fisher alliance seems to have blown up before our faces.) As long as any of the Board members remain there will be a underlying current of distrust and disunity. I'm saying all the Board members don't have to agree, but they have to work together.

Since the intellectual level has dropped I will stoop to some posters' level (for a short time).

GuestZero- I am one of the "overpaid, lazy, good-for-nothing" teachers you love to talk about. But I bet you a bottle of Blatz (I know where to find them) that you would not have the guts to do my job. Those kids would eat your angry ass alive and then laugh at your stupid ass. If I'm so overpaid why aren't you jumping on the gravy-train? I know because you'll have some bullshit answer, well, I would like to hear it. One last thing GuestZero, you seem to be an angry, insecure (maybe it's something physical or mental), profane jackass. I know kids that act like you, and now I know not all of them go to jail, they just make angry posts.

Purnhrt- I will not use any profanity to you, because I think you trully are trying to help people, but I don't agree with your tactics. You seem to like to attack teachers for supposedly lying or underhanded things. But telling children not to go to school and not bettering themselves seems to be quite misguided. It also takes some credibility from any argument you make (kind of like when the Neo-Nazis start talkin' their trash). If I have misidentified you, I'm sorry, but I think I know who you are.

Oh, was I the only who found it funny that the TFT sent Dal Lawrence on to the Bridges talk show (a must-see show for the area) on Sunday? I thought that guy was dead. (In a regal tone) Long live Dal.

Maggie- Nice quote. But I thought that Mrs./Ms. Fisher did have a partnership with Mr. Torres, and I thought that they were trying make changes in the district. It seems NOW that she is on her own. When did this separation take place? I still think that all of them should go. Whether they do or not is up to the voters of Toledo (which I'm one of). Also can you really see the Sister islands from Polish Ottawa Hills?

Good quote by Sam Adams, but he also said:
"Beer and chocolate are two pleasures that should be enjoyed and savored, ... We knew that we were up to the challenge to create an unexpected brew that could perfectly complement a Valentine's Day meal or be given as a special gift."

It's not meant to make a point, it's just funny what the founding fathers say.

I actually got this off the back of a Sam Adams beer bottle:)

Purnhrt- If I'm thinking of the same teacher at Leverette that you're thinking of then, yes he should have beeen toasted royally. I was referring to one of your posts a few days back when you said you went to a hearing and stated that a teacher lied and it was obvious. How do you know that? Oh yeah, I've seen you at LHS and you seem to try to defend some of the bigger jerks in the system. Not all of the jerks are misunderstood children, some are simply jerks.

Oh if you're wondering about Polish Ottawa Hills (Point Place), it is a reference by those of us of Polish extract (I'm the imfamous combination of South End Pole and Lenawee County African-American if you're wondering). Point Place was viewed by many Nort (that's how they say North on Langrinka) Enders as a place where you "made it." Obviously, Maggie you are not Polish or you would have known. If you're wondering, I have heard the Point referred as Carptown, Boat Clubville, and Swamp City. Also, I was told by my father (the infamous F.Weso) to stay out of the Point, because it is not the most welcoming part of town for those of us that have a little melonin.

Kateb- Don't fret hopefully we can get rid of all of the Board and start anew. So sit back and drink a Sam Adams or a Blatz and wait for November.

Oh yeah, I guess I should drop a quote:
"God made the Idiot for practice, and then He made the School Board."
-Mark Twain (he's such a smart and funny guy)

You're esteemed public servant.


Darlene Fisher is very much on her own. And I'm sad to say that I think the forces that oppose her are likely to win.

And we, we all will lose.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

to a Neo-Nazi before. Kind of interesting.

Polish Ottawa Hills? Toledo really has some issues.

And I attacked teachers for supposedly lying about what and what underhanded things did I accuse teachers of doing. I know I was involved in a teacher inappropriatly touching a female student at Leverette. But that was substantiated and the teacher had his teacher's certificate lifted. Is that the underhanded thing you are talking about?

are most awfully tired. And sad.

Send reinforcements. We want to go home and sleep for a bit.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

going into the Editorial room.?


So no telling what they were cooking up at the Blade today.

is not spelled melonin. Those of us with it should at least know how to spell it. No offense meant!

A little touchy about the spelling? I'm glad that you like to call out the little things, keeps people on their tows:)

Oh yeah, I like skeptical people that means that they think. Just so you know I don't spew bull pooh for no reason hear iz the kwote that eye wuz talking about from purnhrt:) "I don't expect everyone to understand this statement but I just returned from a suspension hearing where the teacher just outright lied (on paper, didn't have to courage to attend and lie face to face to the parent) and should be disciplined, but that won't happen."

My questions: How do you know that people are lying? Do you take every case of kids getting suspended or do you just pick and chose? Do you think I'm asshole? (Well that might be obvious.)

Oh yeah, the editorial spin is coming for us from the megapowers of education, be prepared.

Your melonin enhanced public servant:)


on Friday at 8:30 AM. Probably to announce and give details on Foley's contract.

Wow that was quick!!!

The title has nothing to do with the subject, just that its my current situation after today's track meet.

SFlagg- You don't have time to right a book? Shoot you could probably fill a couple a hundred pages with your posts. Also do you think the TFT is out to block every reform initiative? I don't think so. Hell, the union fires more teachers through the intern process than the administrators do. Oh yeah, there are teachers who complain about the union, heck I've complained about the union, but don't sit here and say its only the union that holds the district back. Who elected your hated rivals Sykes, Barnett, and Steel (and now Torres)? You did...the public. If the public elects reactionaries then you must blame the public (You and I and the crazy guy down the street are the public). As far as the baby and the water analogy, well, there is no baby. Fisher is part of the dirty water. Yes, she has pointed out major problems, but has she offered any solutions? NO! She waffles and doesn't make a decision. This allows Sykes and Co. to do what they want. Tell her this is the Board of Education and this is the dirtiest political position in the county. You can't be nice. She should stuff it up that dudes arse when she gets a chance, but she won't. That's how you survive and thrive in politics. If she can't, then how about you Mr. Flagg. You run for Board.

Kateb- Be skeptical with anyone involved in education on any level. Purnhrt will only tell what she wants you to know. I will do the same thing. But don't get fooled into thinking that she is some saint. No one (especially myself) is as good as you make her sound. She has an agenda (power grabbing), and I have my agenda (I haven't quite figured it out, but I'm working on it). Just watch your back the friendliest people in education and politics are also the most conniving.

Purnhrt- Proofread my post and point out my grammatical mistakes:)

Your melanin enhanced public servant (See I learned from my mistake:)


I know this thread is about TPS, but no one on here has any comments about the suburban school levy massacres? I thought I would have heard a cackle at least from GuestZero.

It is good that you come here and debate. You can even create front page posts like everyone else. If any current board member, or even candidate wants to post, they are welcome to create an account and talk about their issue. This site is here to foster debate and discussion and any political, news, event discussion is fair game. If you are in the news you may be talked about here.

While some may disagree with how Twila and Steve do things, they don't profit off of the district. They are there in public-not hiding behind the scenes-trying to make the district better. I am sure you are too, but that does not minimize anyone's ability to have a stake in the system. The fact is you and them have the same motivation.

I noticed you said that the Toledo Plan fires more teachers than principals would, actually this is not true. Check out Brian Jacob, professor at John F. Kennedy School of Government at Harvard University's work. His stats show the firing rate is very similar to the intern plan. Even the types of teachers dismissed are similar, so there is no real difference in the two systems. There is a difference in the accountability.

Contrary to what some may think, I chime in on threads when I feel I have something to add or say something that has not been said.

This is my 2 cents.

Mr. Flagg, I think you misunderstand my posts. I don't believe Fisher has the right stuff to effect change in the system. That is why I asked you to run. I was hoping that you would have the right stuff. I understand that you may like to work in the background (So do I). But I am not trying to harass or follow you (you're not that important). I only wish to question some of your comments. Just like I question Kateb or Purnhrt (nothing personal dude). You and Fisher aren't evil, but you can't back someone who can't get the job done.

Mr. Myers, forgive me for I could not find the information from the website you provided. Could you help me find it. I guess my position in this discussion is that I'm a cynical jerk. I believe that whether its Sykes, Barnett, Steele, Fisher, Torres, Myers, Flagg, or Page they are nothing more than power-hungry publicity hounds. I'm sure if Mr. Myers and company got into power there would be a wonderful time of change, BUT eventually this group would become bloated boars who only wished to protect their power (sounds familiar). Listen you're not evil, nor is Sykes...maybe. But don't sit here a say this isn't a political power game. Always has always will be.

Wow that's pretty cynical isn't it.

Until now, I've stayed away from conversations on this site however, I noted your most recent comment and quite frankly am seeking your advice. What is the right stuff to effect change in TPS? If I read your note correctly it focuses on people wanting power. For me personally, that is not the case. I have had children in the district and worked as a volunteer for more than 17 years now and see TPS as an organization that doesn't understand why it needs to change.

Several years ago Steve Flagg prodded Peter Silverman for the Board to enter into a strategic planning process. That occurred in 2000 just as Dr. Sanders was coming on board. I attended each of the 3 interviews for the hiring of such consultant. As you may recall Phil Schletchy was hired. The Committee for School Reform took 2 years to discuss and create a plan that had 10 Standards. These standards were broken out into specific committees and the first one was Understanding the Need for Change. That never got off the ground. I attended one sub committee meeting headed by Stan Woody and Marge Goldstein and beyond that there were no other meetings and the entire process simply died. So does that say all the members of the Committee for School Reform couldn't effect change? I look to your advice. Or if you wish, please call me at the Board office. I'd look forward to speaking to you directly. Best regards, Darlene Fisher

s. wego - you'll have to bring me up to speed on the levies. Out of town w/my daughter in the hospital at Valpo. Sitting on a stool, trying to type quietly on this miserable laptop keyboard.

What happened w/the vote Tuesday?

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

You said

"But don't sit here a say this isn't a political power game. Always has always will be."

I probably should stay out of this zone but since I started the thread with the John Foley "issue" I will say that I am not aware of any political power, publicity power-hungry power that I have or am seeking.

If anything, if my quest for answers (which occurred in 1994) had been satisfied I would just be an old lady sitting around doing what I like to do best and that is read a book.

But because I had young children in school (and still do plus grandchildren) I was not satisfied with the life that TPS had mapped out for my children. The more I dug, the more I found that except for a few, no child was immune from the life destroying policies of this "public" school system. (Now I may not say things the way people want to hear things but that is not my problem. I call em like I see em.) Old School.

Until TPS recognizes that parents and community should help drive the school or there are quality schools for all children (whichever comes first)then I will be out here with the "freaks" as stated by Mr. Dal Lawrence.

Mrs./Ms. Fisher- Here is my advice. Don't sit back and take it. In my view you seem to be passive. Not in questioning what's going on. But in the case of politics. Listen, I voted for you. But you're in a political office and you have to have more political savy. That means you have to be smart (which your are), but you have to be ruthless. You may not be willing to, but this is Toledo and these guys play rough and dirty in politics. Your opponents are good at what they do, so you have to be better. If not you're going to be, then you are in for a long and draining ride. Oh and to answer your question about the committe for reform...yes they all could not effect change. This education "business" has changed from being about a social good to getting results. And as a taxpayer I need results. Isn't that what people say about teachers and administrators? I can empathize with you in that the deck is stacked against you, but you have to beat your opponents. I tried to get Mr. Flagg run for Board, but he refuses. Myers is running, but you need three (To be honest, its going to be tough for Myers to get elected since he is a Republican in a strongly Democrat town). I do have a question, what happened to your alliance with Torres? People seem to think that you are alone. If true, then you must work on forging and maintaining alliances (another political skill).

Kateb- The suburban districts got murdered on Tuesday in their levy bids. Rossford passed one and failed another, leaving the district with a $3 million shortfall. The Blade (take this as you wish) says the losses are about gas prices. What!?! Something about people can't control gas prices, but they can control property taxes. Hey, read the article yourself and try to figure it out. Oh yeah, TPS says their worried about putting on levy (I don't think it's the gas prices that will kill the levy there are 5 other reasons).

Purnhrt- Can't condone Dal calling you a freak. Of course, I did compare you to Neo-Nazis (call me a hypocrite). I will say that it seems that you never turn down an interview and you don't shy away from the news cameras, but that could be because you're quite photogenic (check spelling, please:). If calling how you see it makes you old school, then I must be old school too (Wow, I alway thought I was progressive). Oh and most lives that are destroyed are not done by the public schools, its done by their friends and family. I don't lock kids in cages or smoke drugs around them (Sorry, that's my choice).

Oh and if you like books, I do suggest "Jefferson's War" by Joseph Wheelan.

I think you've made about your mind about Darlene Fisher. She has conducted herself in an admirable manner. Were you at the board meetings or have you personally observed the conduct between the board members? Because several times you have said the things that I have stated, myself - first hand - are not the way things are.

So at this point I want to know if you are making observations of your own or just repeating someone elses' talking points? Because I'm sorry - you are just wrong on this one.

I don't think anybody will have an easy levy in the near future.

I also cannot fault people who see terrible deficiencies for taking every opportunity to discuss it with the public in the hopes that someone will care enough to help.

Not sure where you are coming from...but I'm open for conversation about it.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

s.weso, obviously not everyone agrees with what you say, but it is good for you to provide your point of view.

I will prove you wrong about the chances part and maybe you get the change you seem to desire. Do you sound cynical? Yes, but so are most people in this town. It is OK. Once you get solid group of people who really care about making things better, everything will improve. I believe the cynicism derives from the lack of leadership, but it is only temporary.

Tpsteacher24, you're doing a very good job at (I'd imagine) the behest of whatever administrator that promised you your own administrator job in trade for this kind of bullshit. Good work. Now pardon the fuck out of me as I demolish your childish propaganda.

1. This negotiation with Foley is happening in seemingly record time. Hmm. I wonder why Harner was unable to receive the same speedy treatment from the TPS Board negotiators? Double hmm. Well, that's enough "hmm"-ing. Any sane reading of the emails supplied by the Urban Coalition website (which I'm sure you've read, right?) would show the prior "negotiation" was nothing of the sort. The delays alone (combined with Sykes' OUTRIGHT LIES about the schools Harner was looking at for his daughter) say everything about the complete lack of good faith on the part of the TPS in pursuing Harner. The Board's 5-0 vote to negotiate was a pure sham, and that sham was presided over by LARRY SYKES (and to some extent, Robert Torres, who's involvement is still unknown to me).

2. Fisher had been beating her head against the wall in trying to pry answers out of the nearly-mum Sykes about the entire negotiation process. Again, the emails show Fisher trying (in vain, I'd think) to get to any rational step in the negotiation process. Again, you'd know this, if you'd read those documents.

Tpsteacher24, it surely chaps my britches to see people like you try to spin this entire Sykes-dominated fraud in such a way that clearly opposes the truth in publicly-available documents. I'm sure that there are many people like you in the TPS who rely on public ignorance, which is the foundation that you build your house of propaganda on. The TPS' recent history of intense hostility towards the public is enough of an indicator of what you little fuckers are scheming over, behind the scenes in your guarded enclaves (i.e. schools).

Well, it's on. You still rely on us for the money for your overly-paid jobs, and those haven't fared too well lately, now, have they? Count on further opposition. That "deferred pay raise" MOU is going to get a lot more public exposure as far as I'm concerned. One lousy MOU will eat up an entire levy. The public's going to know THAT FACT much better than it does today. Kiss your stupid raise goodbye ... and try producing EDUCATED CHILDREN, while you're at it!


How can you possibly say I am towing the 'party line' when I have called out the ENTIRE board several times for screwing up the Harner negotiations? You can all defend Fisher the end, but she is just as responsible as the rest. If she was so concerned about Sykes screwing it up, she should have put it on her shoulders to do something about it. Not being informed is no excuse, she should have made herself informed and done something to get it done!

...the role you play is not to actually effect change when you are so outnumbered - but to keep the flame of change alive by speaking out and sharing information when you get it.

To say that Darlene is ineffectual because she is by herself in standing for accountability and fiscal responsibility does a disservice to what she is actually accomplishing.

Does anyone really think that we'd be as informed as we are if Darlene had not been on the board? Don't you appreciate having at least one individual who isn't afraid to ask questions and keep asking until there is a satisfactory answer?

For me - I'd say yes. But then, I recognize that there will be times where you will not be able to change the will of the majority on an elected board so you must make sure that the public knows there was an alternative. Darlene is playing that role on TPS and that means that she is being effectual...

Founding Father Samuel Adams said "It does not take a majority to succeed, just a tireless minority willing to light brushfires in people's minds."

...s.weso, you really can see forever...but I've not heard of the Point referred to as Polish Ottawa Hills, before. Very interesting.

As for what happened with Torres, I don't know. There are quite a few who are wondering the same thing...

...hubby likes Sam Adams...

I'm not giving anyone a pass. What I believe is that lumping all together, just like with the board, is not appropriate. GZ went general in his comments and while he was at it he lumped Teacher24 in with everyone without considering all the circumstance.

Teacher24 surely knows a lot of what is going on in our schools including how union leadership is responsible for stopping any real reform.

If you don't stand up, then you become part of the problem and not the solution. Too many teachers look the other way when they can see what is happening. For that everyone who knows bears blame.

So Teacher24 just like Fisher has to take some of the blame. Should we fire all the teachers that know something is wrong in TPSland?

Interesting how you can spin an argument and end up getting caught up in the web.

I have watched Darlene Fisher since February of last year. She kept her campaign promises, she kept her cool and didn't respond to horrifyingly bad behavior out of Larry Sykes and has taken alot of heat for obstinately refusing to compromise the best interests of the children of this district.

She uncovered 1800 MuO's which have largely negotiated a new union relationship OUT contract negotiations or board approval.

She found contractors shorting the materials, specifically when two cement block walls fell down and it was discovered the contractor charged for one size and then used a smaller, substandard block. That guy is now gone.

She's been arguing for zero based budgeting, because it's the only honest way to get out of a fiscal mess like we're in. We're getting that next year -

And we don't want her on the board again - why? Because the people who are the problem don't like her?

I do, we need more politicians who get the job done like this.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.

the statement about. From what I know about her interactions, she may only be dealing with problematic staff and upset kids. So that's her perspective, while you undoubtedly have different experiences. Her judgment is pretty good - so while there may be someone that gets over on her once in a while - I'd say it would be very rare and she'd catch onto that childs' game pretty quick.

If you're here to tell me it's my fault - you're right. I meant to do it. It was alot of fun. That's why I have this happy smile on my face.


I don't think this discussion can go much further - but I thank you for your thoughts. I'll keep posting and you keep following me around. I'll put the data out there with my thoughts. You do your thing and we'll let everyone decide for themselves. Not everyone has to run for office - typical ploy to say if you don't put up then shut up - there are roles besides running for office because if that is the only avenue to bring about change and improvement in our community then we all have to shut up! Cheers

BTW - there have been oh so many solutions proposed by those of us you believe are evil - including Fisher. Sanders promoted most of them as his own, but most of the time did nothing to implement just PR. Did you think TPS, TAAP and TFT would credit us? I don't think so.

Here is your link:

I obviously don't agree about the power-hungry publicity hound comment. You have a point about the bloated boar, but don't measure me on what has come before. I am really rooted in reality and yes, some people can remain that way.

Kateb- I can only comment on what I know or see. I already know the other Board members are jerks. Sorry, I don't go to Board meetings, because I would probably laugh all the way through. Oh and these are my opinions, no one is pulling my strings. Yes, I have a strong opinion on Fisher, but it can be changed. But she will have to change her approach. I know you think she behaves admirably, but this position isn't about admiration. You got to fight your opponents with the same vigor they have. If they play dirty, you play dirty. It's politics. If Fisher wants to be civil, she is in the wrong place. We're talking about the Board of Ed. If the other Board members behave badly then Fisher needs to pull out her belt and whack 'em. Bullys only understand force (Of course, I'm talking figuratively). If they are rude, then be rude back. That's all they will understand.

Kate if you are accusing me of plagerism, I am shocked and hurt (Well not really:). May be we see the same things, but have slightly different interpretations. Part of that is that you are closer to the policy makers, and I carry out the policy. You're view of things are from the top-down. You talk to Board members, and follow closely what they do or say. My view is from the bottom-up. I carry out the orders, but believe (like many on the bottom) that the people on the top don't know anything that's going on and don't care.

I do agree with you about pointing out deficiencies, but if you are trying to defend purnhrt then understand this...I have never told a student, "Don't go to school, because I don't like what's going on at your school." She has and that's wrong.

I checked out the article you provided. I did not see any mention of the Toledo Plan, but it was an interesting article. I will say while reading it, I thought of ways to "butter-up" my principal to get a great rating and a pay raise (I know the man loves donuts). Also the cynical side of me says you're opening yourself for some administrative abuse. Here's an extreme example, "A male principal sexually harasses a female teacher and threatens her with a bad rating if she does not go to bed with him."

If this was the correct article, I'm sorry that I missed the important part.

You'll prove the chances wrong. We'll see.

Oh and the inside scoop is that Sykes won't run for re-election. Actually, I got that from a pretty good source that was approached about running in his place.

if you had read any posts that I have put on this site and ToledoTalk you would realize that I am in total agreement with you. All you see is the word teacher in my site name and you attack. Since you so often use profanity as your backdrop and your way to get your point across allow me to retort. You are a FUCKING MORON!!! I am the one who started the story about the board not hiring Harner dumbass. I am the one who has repeatedly called for the board and the admin. to stop jacking around and get something accomplished, not only with the Harner hiring but with the entire TPS in general. You should try reading some of the posts I have put on these sites. And, yes by the way I read every email and piece of literature available about the whole situation. Go back several months on Fisher and Torres' own website and you will see that Harner was my pick from day one. As I have had it out with your dumbass before on another site I expect nothing less from you, but maybe you should review a little so you don't look so fucking stupid next time. And for all of you that are insulted, I apologize for my profanity and straight forwardness, but that seems to be the only way this idiot communicates.

...harder to do.

There's a point, when a board makes a decision, that you trust the people tasked with carrying out that decision. Fisher trusted Sykes and Torres to carry out negotiations. Considering the criticism she'd gotten for not 'going along,' this makes a lot of sense to try and support the board's decision to allow two members to negotiate.

It's easy to say that she should have informed herself. Sometimes, when things are deliberately being withheld, it takes longer to discover what EXACTLY is going on and how to correct it.

Once she did find out that negotiations were not progressing, she first worked inside the system to try and correct it. When it became public, she was able to take a more public approach herself.

I'm reminded of the old 'until you walk a mile in someone's shoes' phrase.

Considering that I've found myself in similar circumstances, I fault the two people conducting the negotiations, first, and then the President of the Board (primarily for NOT making the first phone call to Harner to congratulate him on his selection and for not making sure that ALL board members were equally informed of the progress - or lack thereof - in negotiations.)

It's easy, in hindsight, to tell elected officials what they should or shouldn't have done. While both Fisher and Steel MIGHT HAVE been able to do something different, I don't think that they are EQUALLY culpable in this instance. Personally, I think Darlene is the only one who handled herself appropriately in this fiasco.

Mr. Flagg could you explain how the TFT prevents any type of reform. Your comment seems to be unsubstantiated.

If there is someone who gets a pass on this site it is Fisher. I understand that many of you are supporters of Fisher and that's okay (I actually voted for her and Torres). But don't make her out to be a saint (she is better than the others though, but that's not saying much). Her woe-is-me-I'm-all-by-myself act is convincing, but people shouldn't assume (Yes, Kate I used the word again) that she is doing the right thing. I think she's just another political hack on the school board.

I'll use the root method in delivering my point. Get rid of all the Board members. Vote them out. If ANY of them stay it will lead to just more negative feelings. Might I suggest Mr. Flagg, if you support Fisher then you run for the Board. And why not have purnhrt run also. The best way to change a system is to infiltrate it and change it from within. I don't think Fisher can, and she has to leave. But maybe you two can.

purnhrt- Check for spelling errors and get back to me:)

Frankly I can't even begin to tell all what I mean by stopping reform.

However as a teacher, you must be aware of how the leadership "interferes and undermines" decisions at local schools and programs in general that they don't like or did not come from them. The building committees simply act in most schools as an extension of the TFT leadership. I have numerous examples and some of the recent best examples involve the KnowledgeWorks initiatives beginning with the votes at Rogers (and second vote) as well as union leadership balking at putting in place quantifiable performance measures for the small schools concepts at Scott and Libbey. There is a great story to tell here.

I don't have time to write a book for you at this time. But I can't believe you have not seen some of the same efforts at your school or do not know other teachers at other schools that could relate their woes.

I'm not avoiding you, I'm just waiting for the appropriate time to discuss it in greater detail.

Are you the type that throws out the baby with the bath water. Just because the board is inept does not mean that every board member is responsible.

Watch the Foley negotiations! I'll bet Fisher is the only one that asks questions and makes sure we don't have a golden parachute that could cost us big like the Sanders episode and other items such as a performance review, etc.......

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